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            1              SCRANTON CITY COUNCIL MEETING

 

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            3

 

            4

 

            5                          HELD:

 

            6

 

            7                  Tuesday, April 14, 2009

 

            8

 

            9                        LOCATION:

 

           10                    Council Chambers

 

           11                 Scranton City Hall

 

           12              340 North Washington Avenue

 

           13                Scranton, Pennsylvania

 

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           23

                    CATHENE S. NARDOZZI, RPR - OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER

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            2   CITY OF SCRANTON COUNCIL:

 

            3

 

            4

                MR. ROBERT MCGOFF, PRESIDENT

            5   (Not present)

 

            6   MS. JUDY GATELLI, VICE-PRESIDENT

 

            7

                MS. JANET E. EVANS

            8   (Not present)

 

            9   MS. SHERRY FANUCCI

 

           10

                MR. WILLIAM COURTRIGHT

           11

 

           12   MS. KAY GARVEY, CITY CLERK

 

           13

                MR. NEIL COOLICAN, ASSISTANT CITY CLERK

           14

 

           15   MR. AMIL MINORA, SOLICITOR

 

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            1   (Pledge of Allegiance recited and moment of reflection

 

            2   observed.)

 

            3                      MS. GATELLI: Roll call, please?

 

            4                      MR. COOLICAN:  Mrs. Evans. Mrs.

 

            5              Gatelli.

 

            6                      MS. GATELLI:  Here.

 

            7                      MR. COOLICAN:  Ms. Fanucci.

 

            8                      MS. FANUCCI:  Here.

 

            9                      MR. COOLICAN:  Mr. Courtright.

 

           10                      MR. COURTRIGHT:  Here.

 

           11                      MR. COOLICAN:  Mr. McGoff.

 

           12                      MS. GATELLI: Dispense with the

 

           13              reading of the minutes.

 

           14                      MS. GARVEY: Third Order.  No

 

           15              business at this time.

 

           16                      MS. GATELLI:  Before we start with

 

           17              citizens' participation I just have a few

 

           18              announcements.  First of all, Mrs. Evans

 

           19              called in she wasn't feeling well, and

 

           20              Mr. McGoff has been hospitalized so please

 

           21              keep him in your prayers.  He is doing okay,

 

           22              it's nothing real serious, but he was

 

           23              hospitalized this afternoon.  And for those

 

           24              of you who were interested in my husband,

 

           25              and that is the reason I wasn't here last


 

 

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            1              week, we went to New York City to have a

 

            2              consultation.  He was having problems with

 

            3              his knees and we were very successful and

 

            4              thank God he is feeling much better and

 

            5              thank you for all your thoughts, phone calls

 

            6              and prayers about that.

 

            7                      Saturday, this Saturday as a matter

 

            8              of fact, the 18th, there will be a Night at

 

            9              the Races for the West Side Invader Dugout

 

           10              Club.  That will be at 7:00 at the Keyser

 

           11              Valley Community Center.  Also, this

 

           12              Saturday, Scranton High School is having a

 

           13              Night at the Races for their football team

 

           14              and that will at Holy Rosary Hall on Market

 

           15              Street at 7:00.

 

           16                      On April 26, Sunday evening, there

 

           17              will be a Moonlight walk/run for the

 

           18              Children's Advocacy Center.  You may call

 

           19              969-7313.  It's at Nay Aug Park and it

 

           20              starts at 6:00 p.m.

 

           21                      This Saturday there will be two

 

           22              cleanups.  There will be one in South

 

           23              Scranton at the Penn Security parking lot.

 

           24              We will meet there at 8 a.m., and there will

 

           25              also be another one at Fellows Park in West


 

 

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            1              Scranton on Main Avenue and that will also

 

            2              be starting at 8:00, so if anyone wishes to

 

            3              volunteer we certainly could appreciate you

 

            4              coming to help at either site West Scranton

 

            5              or South Scranton.

 

            6                      I would also like to tell you that I

 

            7              know and I mentioned, oh, probably about a

 

            8              month ago that there was a benefit for a

 

            9              gentleman by the name of Joseph Noones, and

 

           10              I would just like to have you keep his

 

           11              family in your prayers because he passed

 

           12              away this week, and they would like to thank

 

           13              you for all your contributions and your

 

           14              thoughts and prayers for Mr. Noones.

 

           15                      I'd like to also send a letter to

 

           16              two West Scranton students, one is Michael

 

           17              Genello, who is a senior, and he received

 

           18              the Art Wall Scholarship for his golfing

 

           19              skills.  He is also a top notch student in

 

           20              school and received a presidential

 

           21              scholarship to the University of Scranton.

 

           22              He is majoring in biology and ultimately

 

           23              hoping for a career in dentistry.

 

           24                      And also we had another student, the

 

           25              Sixth Annual Cane competition at the


 

 

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            1              University of Scranton.  There were 15 teams

 

            2              from the high schools and they spent the day

 

            3              testing their physics knowledge.  West

 

            4              Scranton had two teams which placed 8th and

 

            5              14th in the team competition, but one of the

 

            6              students, Michael Bartilotti that took first

 

            7              place in the individual competition and he

 

            8              received a plaque and $2,000 scholarship to

 

            9              the University of Scranton.

 

           10                      And the last think I have, I don't

 

           11              know how we can check into this, but I know

 

           12              everybody has been talking about the bins

 

           13              that they have at various locations for

 

           14              clothing, and when I was reading the

 

           15              Electric City News I found it advertisement

 

           16              in there encouraging churches and other

 

           17              organizations to put these bins up.  If you

 

           18              place our clothing collection boxes at your

 

           19              location you can be paid $500 a year with

 

           20              $200 up front to be paid per pound for what

 

           21              the box collects and it's called recycling

 

           22              for Pennsylvania Incorporated, 2000 Roseanna

 

           23              Avenue, 18509, so I'm going to ask Kay to

 

           24              please inquire about this.  I know we talked

 

           25              about it before, they don't need permits or


 

 

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            1              anything, but if there are too many

 

            2              sprinkled throughout the community I

 

            3              certainly don't think it's an asset and it's

 

            4              certainly not helping the Salvation Army at

 

            5              all to have these located sporadically

 

            6              throughout our city.  Some of them have

 

            7              graffiti on them and I really would like to

 

            8              check with zoning, etcetera, to see if these

 

            9              are legitimate because now they are

 

           10              advertising for groups to be paid to put

 

           11              them in their location, and that's all I

 

           12              have.  Anything?  The first speaker is Andy

 

           13              Sbaraglia.

 

           14                      MR. SBARAGLIA: Andy Sbaraglia.

 

           15              Citizen of Scranton, fellow Scrantonians.  I

 

           16              believe them boxes were put in by somebody

 

           17              for profit.  That's a box for profit.  I

 

           18              think I would point out many times and I

 

           19              think there is a little article I think from

 

           20              the Salvation Army saying that, you know,

 

           21              they do the clothes and try to recycle them

 

           22              by these people just sell them and sell them

 

           23              away or rags or something.

 

           24                      Okay.  Usually I talk on agenda

 

           25              items because that's more pertinent, but in


 

 

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            1              Sunday's paper I read an article about the

 

            2              Times, I guess it was on the editorial page

 

            3              attacking Mr. Bolus.  Mr. Bolus did not

 

            4              bring the Genesis Center to Nay Aug. That

 

            5              was done by our mayor, Mayor Doherty brought

 

            6              them.  All Mr. Bolus tried to do was make it

 

            7              better for them up it at the Genesis Center.

 

            8              Now, why they attacked him like that I have

 

            9              no idea.  I realize he -- I realize you

 

           10              might not be able to be elected mayor,

 

           11              everyone knows that, but to attack him on an

 

           12              issue that is really about animals.  That I

 

           13              don't understand.

 

           14                      Now, we all know that our zoo is not

 

           15              up to standard.  That's been told many, many

 

           16              years ago, that's why we closed it, but that

 

           17              Miss -- I guess her name is Miss Miller or

 

           18              Mrs. Miller tried to do something up there

 

           19              and the mayor invited her to the city, and

 

           20              not only that, I guess he was given her

 

           21              maintenance free, heat free, and I think

 

           22              50,000 if she got it all.

 

           23                      I did find out that she paid her own

 

           24              liability insurance, so the city wasn't in

 

           25              on that, but the thing is the animals.  All


 

 

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            1              Mr. Bolus did was try to help that lady and

 

            2              to be attacked for trying to help somebody

 

            3              or help animals, as you know, it's going

 

            4              into litigation now.  It is snowballing and

 

            5              some lawyer I guess got up there and ordered

 

            6              them not to transfer them animals or sell

 

            7              any and so on and forth and so they got an

 

            8              injunction I guess, but the basic problem is

 

            9              the zoo itself.

 

           10                      Now, we spent a fortune for somebody

 

           11              to get up there and say you need a new zoo

 

           12              and it's going to cost $16 million and cost

 

           13              something like $500,000 to take care of it

 

           14              and so far any idiot could have done that.

 

           15              Why they had to spend the money to do that

 

           16              is beyond me.  They could have actually

 

           17              taken that money and did some work on that

 

           18              zoo and that would have been a better use

 

           19              for it than sit out there an engineer it out

 

           20              for something you never could afford to do,

 

           21              but would do a lot of that.  We seem to like

 

           22              to engineer things out for things that can't

 

           23              be done.  I always said I will dig about 30

 

           24              million and build a dam from East to West

 

           25              Mountain to produce hydroelectric power, of


 

 

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            1              course, with Penn Valley, but, hey, it's

 

            2              something now because they come up with

 

            3              these plans that are the same things that --

 

            4              pie in the sky.  They got to.  We are a

 

            5              declining city and it may take 20 years

 

            6              before we even come back up, if we can, but

 

            7              we are in decline now so you try to lift the

 

            8              burden to bring more people in.  You don't

 

            9              try to increase the debt and force more

 

           10              people out and that's what's happening.

 

           11                      Our taxes are highest in the area

 

           12              and you know the people won't come in here

 

           13              unless they can get a KOZ.  They are always

 

           14              telling you we are not going to do nothing

 

           15              in the city unless we get a KOZ.  Bishop

 

           16              Hannon is sitting there, something got to be

 

           17              done with that, eventually it will done with

 

           18              it, maybe that will turn into an office

 

           19              building.  It's hard to say it's made for a

 

           20              good place for offices, but now we are going

 

           21              to -- our good Chamber of Commerce wants to

 

           22              build another office complex and they are

 

           23              looking for another KOZ and you all know

 

           24              that the KOZ's the only person that making

 

           25              the benefit out of KOZ are the people that


 

 

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            1              get the KOZ, and you all know what happened

 

            2              when we were trying to get out there and

 

            3              check and see if they were doing what they

 

            4              were supposed to do and we got the guy --

 

            5              the guy comes overseas to tell us, well,

 

            6              once you got the KOZ we don't do nothing,

 

            7              but I know they are trying to -- they send

 

            8              letters in, they are supposed to send

 

            9              letters in anyway saying they are compliant.

 

           10              Okay.  I thank you.

 

           11                      MS. GATELLI: Lee Morgan.

 

           12                      MR. MORGAN: Good evening, Council.

 

           13              I'm going to probably -- won't need all of

 

           14              my five minutes tonight thankfully, but what

 

           15              I would like to say is, you know, if the

 

           16              wildlife sanctuary goes I just think that it

 

           17              proves that there is really a very serious

 

           18              leadership problem in this city and with

 

           19              this being an election year I just think

 

           20              that people need to pay attention to who

 

           21              they elect because everybody has made a ton

 

           22              of promises and to live in a city and to

 

           23              continually have promises made to you, and

 

           24              some of it touches to some of the things

 

           25              Andy said about, you know, the people just


 

 

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            1              fleeing the city and the decline we are in.

 

            2              It's massive.  The decline is just really

 

            3              unbelievable and then we are presented all

 

            4              of these studies like the zoo.  I think

 

            5              there were two studies done on the new zoo

 

            6              at Nay Aug.  There is tons of money bailed

 

            7              to all of the special interests in the city,

 

            8              all right, and you say to this Mrs. Miller,

 

            9              "Come on in here we have new vision for the

 

           10              city."

 

           11                      We spend all of that money for the

 

           12              landscaping at the park, we did all of these

 

           13              other projects.  The county I believe spent

 

           14              $300,000 for the Performing Arts Center that

 

           15              was up there and I don't know where tat went

 

           16              when they ripped it down and now we are

 

           17              going to put gorillas in there, and I'm just

 

           18              curious to if this lady leaves Nay Aug Park

 

           19              and leaves the sanctuary after we have

 

           20              invited her here and then we have Beatrice

 

           21              Heveran who alleged has something to do with

 

           22              this who is also an attorney and I'm just

 

           23              occur us what are we going to think when all

 

           24              of this goes down and we found out that she

 

           25              is going to have a project there next?


 

 

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            1              That's troubling thing I have, okay?

 

            2                      I mean, this is in my opinion had to

 

            3              be some kind of -- there must be another

 

            4              vision for that center, but the mayor didn't

 

            5              come here and tell us that.  I don't want to

 

            6              throw the mayor's name into this, but he is

 

            7              the chief executive and this was his vision

 

            8              in the beginning, all of this money spent

 

            9              there and now they have litigation in the

 

           10              Courts and now it's come to this point and

 

           11              my point here is what are we going to do

 

           12              with that building now?  There has to be

 

           13              another plan for it?  Are we going to leave

 

           14              it vacant like it was before?  I don't

 

           15              understand.  Why do we do these studies.

 

           16              Why do we spend this money for studies.

 

           17                      MS. GATELLI:  From what I understand

 

           18              the case in the Court today --

 

           19                      MR. MORGAN: Yes.

 

           20                      MS. GATELLI: Mrs. Miller agreed to

 

           21              leave and she is going to leave.

 

           22                      MR. MORGAN: Well, I'm aware of that

 

           23              to a degree, but my point is why did it come

 

           24              to this?  Didn't the council in the budget

 

           25              give that center operating funds in this


 

 

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            1              year's budget?

 

            2                      MS. GATELLI:  I don't believe it was

 

            3              the city at all that was after Mrs. Miller

 

            4              if you want to say -- it was some of the

 

            5              animal rights people that --

 

            6                      MR. MORGAN: I disagree with that.

 

            7                      MS. GATELLI: The Scranton Times is

 

            8              the one --

 

            9                      MR. MORGAN: I think the Scranton

 

           10              Times has absolutely nothing to do with it

 

           11              and I think, Mrs. Gatelli, with all due

 

           12              respect to you, and I'm not trying to demean

 

           13              you in any way, you have taken very

 

           14              unpopular positions here in previous times,

 

           15              and I know this is an election year and I

 

           16              don't really care to go through them at the

 

           17              podium, but I really think you are

 

           18              misinformed, respectfully I'm telling you

 

           19              that.  I think you are misinformed.

 

           20                      MS. GATELLI: Well, I think you need

 

           21              to read the article.

 

           22                      MR. MORGAN: Well, I'm not interested

 

           23              in the article the Scranton Times writes, my

 

           24              point is this, was this the mayor's vision?

 

           25                      MS. GATELLI: Well, go to the Court


 

 

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            1              and get the transcript.

 

            2                      MR. MORGAN: Wait.  You know what,

 

            3              that may be a necessity later.

 

            4                      MS. GATELLI:  The city was not

 

            5              involved in the litigation.

 

            6                      MR. MORGAN: They may not have been,

 

            7              but you know what, when the mayor had you

 

            8              throw us out of council he was still down in

 

            9              his office, okay, so what's that have to do

 

           10              with anything?

 

           11                      MS. FANUCCI: I don't know.

 

           12                      MS. GATELLI: I don't know.

 

           13                      MR. MORGAN: Well, that's the point

 

           14              here, you don't know, and I'm glad you said

 

           15              that, and the problem here is that the mayor

 

           16              and other people manipulate other people to

 

           17              do things and then they all stand back and

 

           18              say they had nothing to do with it, but my

 

           19              point is this, the mayor spent all of these

 

           20              millions of dollars in the park.  He brought

 

           21              her here.  Didn't the council grant her

 

           22              $50,000 in the budget?

 

           23                      MS. GATELLI:  Yes, we did.

 

           24                      MR. MORGAN: Did we do multiple

 

           25              studies up there about a new zoo?


 

 

                                                                      16

 

 

            1                      MS. GATELLI: Yes, we did.

 

            2                      MR. MORGAN: Okay, I rest my point --

 

            3              my case.  Thank you.

 

            4                      MS. GATELLI: And we were not

 

            5              involved in the litigation.  Mr. Miller.

 

            6                      MR. MILLER: Good evening, Council.

 

            7              Doug Miller, Scranton.  You know, last week

 

            8              we heard a presentation on Genesis and, of

 

            9              course, it's already been brought up this

 

           10              evening.  I really hope council is taking a

 

           11              good hard look at this issue because it

 

           12              seems likes, once again, we are allowing

 

           13              someone who, quite frankly, isn't even from

 

           14              this area deciding just to come in here and

 

           15              dictate on the situation, someone who I

 

           16              still would like to know her qualifications.

 

           17              She made comments in the paper and, quite

 

           18              frankly, it's just another example of a

 

           19              bully coming in and trying to bully another

 

           20              person to get her way.

 

           21                      You know, I have been criticized as

 

           22              well as other people who supported Genesis

 

           23              in the editorial section and we have been

 

           24              criticized because we are only raising this

 

           25              issue because we are looking for attention.


 

 

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            1              Well, that's totally inaccurate.  I was here

 

            2              last week speaking on behalf in support of

 

            3              Genesis because I felt it was time someone

 

            4              defended these animals whose lives were on

 

            5              the line and the many volunteers who have

 

            6              spent the last six or seven years donating

 

            7              their time to these animals in the community

 

            8              and now, like I said, we want to bully them

 

            9              and that's what we do in this city.  When

 

           10              certain people don't get their way we

 

           11              continue to bully until they finally get

 

           12              their way and that looks like what's

 

           13              happening here.

 

           14                      And as far as the city not being

 

           15              involved, I think it's quite obvious that

 

           16              they were involved.  This council approved

 

           17              $50,000 funding, we looked into a study, and

 

           18              there are certain people in this

 

           19              administration who are involved, so the city

 

           20              is involved and we know what's going on.  We

 

           21              are not stupid.  We know that there is a

 

           22              plan involved here, this Heveran or whatever

 

           23              her name is, this know it all who came in

 

           24              here and trying to bully.  We know there's

 

           25              another plan.


 

 

                                                                      18

 

 

            1                      MS. FANUCCI: Doug, can I ask you

 

            2              what the plan is because we are not informed

 

            3              of, so if you know there is a plan I'd like

 

            4              to know what it is now since you already

 

            5              know.

 

            6                      MR. MILLER: No, no, no.  There is

 

            7              no specific plan, but we have reason to

 

            8              believe that --

 

            9                      MS. FANUCCI:  Oh, I thought you said

 

           10              there was a plan and we weren't aware of one

 

           11              so -- -

 

           12                      MR. MILLER:  We have reason to

 

           13              believe that there may be a plan.

 

           14                      MS. FANUCCI: So hypothetically

 

           15              there's a plan.

 

           16                      MR. MILLER:  Hypothetic, yeah, that

 

           17              this is why this is going on.

 

           18                      MS FANUCCI: Okay.  I see that's why

 

           19              you are saying.

 

           20                      MR. MILLER:  And that this Mrs.

 

           21              Heveran is involved and that's what we

 

           22              really believe is going on here, and it's

 

           23              ashame because Mrs. Miller has -- was

 

           24              invited here by the city and, you know, now

 

           25              we want to kick her and out and I really


 

 

                                                                      19

 

 

            1              don't understand and that's what really

 

            2              makes us believe that there is an

 

            3              alternative plan for this and that this Mrs.

 

            4              Heveran is involved in it and it's pretty

 

            5              sad.

 

            6                      Moving on, for the last few weeks I

 

            7              have been bringing up the $5.5 million from

 

            8              the Single Tax Office and I know I sound

 

            9              like a broken record and people are probably

 

           10              sick of me bringing it up, but it's

 

           11              important because this goes back to our

 

           12              budget where we had a hole in the budget but

 

           13              we went and plugged this money in, and I'd

 

           14              still like to know what our plan is going to

 

           15              be and I'm hopeful council will make a

 

           16              decision soon.

 

           17                      And, you know, while we are on that

 

           18              subject in the past I have brought up

 

           19              creating an impact fee on KOZ's and

 

           20              nonprofits and wouldn't this be a perfect

 

           21              time to try and generate some revenue when

 

           22              we are having a hard time balancing the

 

           23              budget.  When is council going to look into

 

           24              grant money for the neighborhoods.  I

 

           25              brought this up in the past to look in the


 

 

                                                                      20

 

 

            1              programs to install curbs, sidewalks and

 

            2              street lights.  You know, these are the

 

            3              issues that are important to taxpayers in

 

            4              the city.  I have raised these issues

 

            5              several times and then just seem to have

 

            6              fallen on deaf ears and I'm hopeful council

 

            7              will, you know, take action and really take

 

            8              a look at this Genesis thing here, let me go

 

            9              back to that because it's really important

 

           10              and I just would hate to see someone get

 

           11              bullied out of town because that just seems

 

           12              to be the case here in Scranton.  Thank you.

 

           13                      MS. GATELLI: Mrs. Gawel.

 

           14                      MS. GAWEL:  Hi, Council.  How are

 

           15              you.  The Right-to-Know, it's about time, we

 

           16              knew that.  It simply means that we, the

 

           17              people, the citizens who work and pay the

 

           18              taxes and vote have a right to ask questions

 

           19              and receive answers.  Like the First

 

           20              Amendment, the freedom of speech, the

 

           21              Right-to-Know gives us the rights as

 

           22              citizens to hold politicians we elect

 

           23              accountable for not furnishing information

 

           24              when requested.  It's more than obvious that

 

           25              the don't tell, the mismanagement, the no


 

 

                                                                      21

 

 

            1              management at all and the let's sweep it

 

            2              under the rug is here.  We very rarely get

 

            3              answers even when you people are asking.

 

            4                      Time and time again speakers have

 

            5              come to the podium asking questions and

 

            6              receiving absolutely no answers.  One of the

 

            7              things is when Councilwoman Evans was

 

            8              Finance Chairperson for two years ago or so

 

            9              entertained a motion that all city agencies

 

           10              required -- be required to report their

 

           11              functions and duties to city council

 

           12              annually.  It's a common sense thing and a

 

           13              good way to oversee things and had we maybe

 

           14              done that we wouldn't maybe have as bad as

 

           15              tax issues as we have.

 

           16                      The example, of course, is prior to

 

           17              finding the big bucks in Dunmore that

 

           18              council was informed by tax office employees

 

           19              the tax collector doesn't come to work.  If

 

           20              you don't come to work you can't collect

 

           21              taxes and instead you just hand them right

 

           22              off to NCC and they are getting the money

 

           23              and we are not.  We are losing so much money

 

           24              with NCC it's embarrassing.  We could be out

 

           25              of debt probably and that's what Mr. Doherty


 

 

                                                                      22

 

 

            1              said, you know?

 

            2                      Okay, new subject.  A couple of

 

            3              weeks ago when I was here I ran out of time.

 

            4              I wanted to comment on the letter that you

 

            5              two ladies had written to the Times.  I was

 

            6              thrilled to see that you were actually

 

            7              siding -- not siding, but standing with Mrs.

 

            8              Evans and I was -- and I hope you understand

 

            9              that Scranton is still about 30 years behind

 

           10              when it comes to politics and maybe you

 

           11              should, you know, like maybe now you can see

 

           12              that you really need to work together and

 

           13              try and compromise, and that's all three of

 

           14              yous, you know, I'm not blaming it all on

 

           15              you and maybe you can knock the boy's socks

 

           16              off because I had such hopes for you girls

 

           17              when you got in and I --

 

           18                      MS. GATELLI:  There were two other

 

           19              women also and one is a minority, you know,

 

           20              and she was totally neglected.

 

           21                      MS. GAWEL:  So, you know, I mean, I

 

           22              know all of you were neglected, but I

 

           23              just specifically you three I hope would

 

           24              work better together and, you know, maybe we

 

           25              could get these guys to realize we women


 

 

                                                                      23

 

 

            1              really aren't dumb.  We are really quite

 

            2              intelligence and have can be quite, you

 

            3              know, bright and come up with our own ideas

 

            4              for things.

 

            5                      MS. GATELLI: Excuse me, Officer,

 

            6              could you go out in the hall, please?  There

 

            7              seems to be something going on.

 

            8                      MS. GAWEL: Okay, I would like to

 

            9              know --

 

           10                      MS. GATELLI: I'm sorry, Mrs. Gawel.

 

           11                      MS. GAWEL: That's okay.

 

           12                      MR. JACKOWITZ: It's Phyllis.

 

           13                      MS. GAWEL: I would like to know when

 

           14              any one on council is going to ask our, and

 

           15              I do use the term loosely, our safety

 

           16              director when we will be getting safety

 

           17              equipment for the police cars we used to

 

           18              have.  I'm embarrassed by the lack of

 

           19              concern by the mayor and this

 

           20              administration.  They absolutely do not care

 

           21              for the safety and welfare of the citizens

 

           22              of Scranton.  I hope no one fell for "I'm

 

           23              not closing firehouses or engine companies."

 

           24                      Please, it's an election year.  We

 

           25              are not that my névé.  Thank you.


 

 

                                                                      24

 

 

            1                      MS. GATELLI: Mr. Spindler.

 

            2                      MR. SPINDLER: Good evening, Council,

 

            3              Les Spindler, city resident and taxpayer and

 

            4              homeowner.  In Sunday's Doherty newsletter

 

            5              there was a big article about the tax

 

            6              office.  I can't read the whole article, but

 

            7              there was something that really bothered me

 

            8              that jumped out at me.  It's a quote from

 

            9              the solicitor, Mr. McGovern, and this is

 

           10              quoting him, "This information would be

 

           11              included in an audit, but pardon my language

 

           12              nobody asked for a frickin audit for so many

 

           13              years."

 

           14                      Now, is that language for a

 

           15              solicitor to sue when he is quoted in the

 

           16              paper as saying that?  That's totally

 

           17              ridiculous.  I mean, first we have the tax

 

           18              collector coming here and saying it's none

 

           19              of your business to a question from a

 

           20              council person and then we have this guy

 

           21              talking like this.  This is the people we

 

           22              have running our tax office?  No wonder we

 

           23              have tax bills being sent to dead people.

 

           24              This is a totally uncalled for.

 

           25                      Moving on, I, too, have to talk


 

 

                                                                      25

 

 

            1              about the wildlife center and Chris Doherty

 

            2              is the one that solicited Mrs. Miller.

 

            3              Mrs. Miller didn't come to the city to come

 

            4              to Nay Aug Park and Chris Doherty doesn't

 

            5              $50,000 to give to the wildlife center where

 

            6              he spent millions and millions over the

 

            7              years and I have a list here.  We spent

 

            8              $700,000 on a green fish pond.  $110,000 to

 

            9              renovate a greenhouse which was later torn

 

           10              down and we are building a new one.

 

           11              $750,000 for the Davis trail.  $450,000 to

 

           12              plant grass in Nay Aug.  A $300,000 dog park

 

           13              plus millions spent on crony hires and

 

           14              raises and he doesn't have $50,000 for a

 

           15              wildlife center.  Something is definitely

 

           16              wrong here.

 

           17                      And moving on, the same thing, in

 

           18              Sunday's Doherty newsletter Chris Kelly

 

           19              wrote a letter, I mean, not a letter an

 

           20              article about the wildlife center, and Bob

 

           21              Bolus was only here defending the wildlife

 

           22              center last week wanting to make sure these

 

           23              animals weren't euthanized and Chris Kelly I

 

           24              thought took a terrible shot at Bob Bolus,

 

           25              and I will read the quote from the paper.


 

 

                                                                      26

 

 

            1              Chris Kelly called Mr. Bolus a convicted

 

            2              felon and serial mayoral candidate.  I think

 

            3              that's terrible.  That had nothing to do

 

            4              with the article itself.  I think Chris

 

            5              Kelly should be fired from the

 

            6              Times-Tribune.  All Mr. Bolus was doing here

 

            7              is defending a wildlife center and this guy

 

            8              is calling him names like this?  It's

 

            9              totally outrageous.  It just shows the type

 

           10              of journalism that's in the Doherty

 

           11              newsletter.

 

           12                      Moving on, at last week's school

 

           13              board meeting, school director Phillips

 

           14              brought up about the University of Scranton

 

           15              has bought 152 properties -- I'm sorry, 154

 

           16              properties since 1952 and it's cost the city

 

           17              $20 million in revenue.  Since the year 2000

 

           18              they have bought 75 properties costing the

 

           19              school district $26 million, and the

 

           20              University gives next to nothing to the

 

           21              city, and most of these 75 properties were

 

           22              done under the Doherty administration, also.

 

           23                      Moving on, Mrs. Evans isn't here, I

 

           24              guess, the streets need line paving, but

 

           25              I'll wait until next time.  In the paper


 

 

                                                                      27

 

 

            1              yesterday and I saw walking by that the

 

            2              Country Club Men's Shop is closing downtown.

 

            3              That's one of the businesses Mr. Williams

 

            4              said was part of our booming downtown a few

 

            5              weeks ago.  On that same subject, the owner

 

            6              of the Country Club Men's Shop, Tom Kelly

 

            7              said, the area hasn't grown in the last

 

            8              20 years.  Well, I have been coming to those

 

            9              council meeting for seven years now and we

 

           10              have been saying that all this time, but

 

           11              Chris Doherty seems to think this town is

 

           12              booming, and this is a man who has the

 

           13              business in the city for 26 years and he is

 

           14              saying that this area hasn't grown in

 

           15              20 years, so who is right.

 

           16                      And lastly, I brought this up quite

 

           17              awhile ago and didn't get an answer, in 2005

 

           18              Governor Rendell came and gave Chris Doherty

 

           19              a check for $4.2 million for the North

 

           20              Scranton Junior High School project.  Does

 

           21              anyone know what happened that to money?

 

           22                      MS. GATELLI: I do know that

 

           23              Mrs. Aebli is working with the budget

 

           24              department, with the federal government

 

           25              concerning that project.  I don't know all


 

 

                                                                      28

 

 

            1              of the details, but I know that there were

 

            2              some glitches in the project.

 

            3                      MR. SPINDLER: Well, that's why, I

 

            4              asked a few week ago could we get Mr. Langan

 

            5              here possibly for a caucus and ask him these

 

            6              questions.

 

            7                      MS. GATELLI: He did respond.  I

 

            8              don't have the letter with me tonight.

 

            9                      MS. FANUCCI:  Les, I don't think you

 

           10              were here that week.

 

           11                      MS. GATELLI: Yeah, he did send a

 

           12              response and addressed each issue, we will

 

           13              get you a copy of it.

 

           14                      MR. SPINDLER: I don't know make if I

 

           15              can make it here next week, but I'd

 

           16              appreciate.

 

           17                      MS. GATELLI: Well, maybe Neil can go

 

           18              and look for it.

 

           19                      MR. SPINDLER: I'd appreciate if you

 

           20              could find out where the money --

 

           21                      MS. FANUCCI: Les, last week --

 

           22                      MR. SPINDLER:  I just hope that

 

           23              money didn't end up in somebody's pocket,

 

           24              that's all.  Thank you.

 

           25                      THE COURT:  We will give you the


 

 

                                                                      29

 

 

            1              report, Mr. Spindler.  Can you wait a few

 

            2              minutes?  He will go and look for it.  Mr.

 

            3              Quinn.

 

            4                      MR. QUINN:  Thank you.  Ozzie Quinn,

 

            5              president of the Scranton/Lackawanna

 

            6              Taxpayers' and Citizens' Association.  I

 

            7              read -- recently it was announced by the

 

            8              Chamber of Commerce that there was a venture

 

            9              capital for new businesses that would come

 

           10              into the area and for job creation force,

 

           11              you know, and working in economic

 

           12              development at one time for the Northeastern

 

           13              Pennsylvania Alliance Corp, there is two

 

           14              components -- there is two components to

 

           15              economic development, it's job creation and

 

           16              job retention, and job retention is a

 

           17              hands-on type of situation where actually

 

           18              you should be able to contact the business

 

           19              owner to see what problems may exist.  We

 

           20              see so many businesses closing nowadays not

 

           21              only just now during this recession, but

 

           22              because of the fact that there has been no

 

           23              one, no one out there trying to help these

 

           24              businesses, you know?  They might have

 

           25              problems with parking, zoning.  They might


 

 

                                                                      30

 

 

            1              have problems with capital and I would like

 

            2              to see if the city council would consider

 

            3              letting the chamber know that it should get

 

            4              more involved in business retention, not

 

            5              just new business, okay?  It's pretty tough

 

            6              to snag a new business now a days and we

 

            7              have to hang onto what we got.

 

            8                      I want to ask something and,

 

            9              Mr. Courtright, you are running for the tax

 

           10              collector, all right?  The county pays

 

           11              annually $80,000 for nonwage expenses for

 

           12              furniture, office splice and equipment and

 

           13              the city is supposed to pay for work

 

           14              benefits and wages.  However, the city has

 

           15              paid -- has been paying $100,000 in addition

 

           16              to nonwages or benefits.  Now, to me is this

 

           17              in a budget, I mean, what's the

 

           18              accountability here?  How does it happen?  I

 

           19              mean, I don't want to put you on the spot,

 

           20              but I would like to see you look into that,

 

           21              please.

 

           22                      MR. COURTRIGHT:  I'll do my best.

 

           23                      MR. QUINN: You know what I mean and

 

           24              try to find out --

 

           25                      MR. COURTRIGHT: I don't think they


 

 

                                                                      31

 

 

            1              are going to be too cooperative with me over

 

            2              there, but I'll ask.

 

            3                      MR. QUINN: Yeah, because, I mean, if

 

            4              we are spending a hundred --

 

            5                      MS. GATELLI:  I don't think it's

 

            6              just you, Bill.

 

            7                      MS. FANUCCI:  No, I don't either.

 

            8                      MR. QUINN:  Because besides the

 

            9              raises and the benefits if we're giving them

 

           10              another $100,000 that's a lot of money, you

 

           11              know?

 

           12                      MS. GATELLI: I think the district

 

           13              pays half, too.

 

           14                      MR. COURTRIGHT: Yeah, the school

 

           15              district pays half.

 

           16                      MR. QUINN:  The school district pays

 

           17              $100,000 and the city pays $100,000, and I'm

 

           18              very much concerned about, you know, what --

 

           19                      MR. COURTRIGHT:  The article said

 

           20              they didn't even know and they are there.

 

           21              Didn't the article say they didn't know

 

           22              about it?  I read the article.

 

           23                      MR. QUINN:  I don't know what the --

 

           24              nobody knows where the money is going -- why

 

           25              the money is there for.  That's what I'm


 

 

                                                                      32

 

 

            1              trying to find out, the accountability.  The

 

            2              business agent, the business manager, a

 

            3              business administrator didn't know.

 

            4                      MR. COURTRIGHT: Maybe we can ask Kay

 

            5              as a council if we could ask that question

 

            6              because I think it would be have a little

 

            7              bit more weight and meat than myself asking

 

            8              that.

 

            9                      MR. QUINN:  Okay.  That's we have --

 

           10              like 100 -- again $170 million in debt, no

 

           11              way -- any way you slice the pie, okay, and

 

           12              you know -- you know, we see these Nay Aug

 

           13              we see with the Wildlife Genesis, okay, and

 

           14              the -- I don't know, I feel sad because of

 

           15              the fact that, you know, when you -- when

 

           16              you look at the letters to the editors and

 

           17              whatnot most of these letters are coming

 

           18              from outside of the city, you know, and we

 

           19              are paying taxpayers' money, city money,

 

           20              taxpayers' money, not only taxpayers'

 

           21              grants, which is taxpayers' money, and the

 

           22              kids have to pay to swim up there why

 

           23              anybody else can go into the park free.

 

           24              They can go into there and go to the Genesis

 

           25              -- Wildlife Genesis, picnic and whatever,


 

 

                                                                      33

 

 

            1              okay, and I don't think that these children

 

            2              should be -- have to pay up there especially

 

            3              from the Hill Section because that was their

 

            4              pool for so many years.

 

            5                      You know, we might have -- we should

 

            6              start to consider as some income trying to

 

            7              charge some kind of a fee to get into the

 

            8              park because it's a ridiculous, you know,

 

            9              that what we are doing here by charging

 

           10              these kids and everyone else from outside

 

           11              the region roam around in there.  Thank you.

 

           12                      MS. GATELLI:  Thank you, Mr. Quinn.

 

           13              Mr. Jackowitz.

 

           14                      MR. JACKOWITZ: Good evening madame

 

           15              acting president, city council members.

 

           16              Bill Jackowitz, South Scranton resident,

 

           17              member of the Taxpayers' Association, all

 

           18              taxes paid in full, two parking tickets paid

 

           19              within 24 hours of issuance.  Bionic,

 

           20              Akerman, believe it or not I care.

 

           21                      At least week's meeting it was nice

 

           22              to hear that Sarena O'Malley's problem with

 

           23              her land on Maple Street was finally

 

           24              resolved.  My question is why did it take

 

           25              15 years, two administrations, Mayor Connors


 

 

                                                                      34

 

 

            1              and Mayor Doherty?  I realize that 2009 is

 

            2              an election year and that Mayor Doherty and

 

            3              Councilwoman are running for reelections,

 

            4              and again, everything that I say, please,

 

            5              don't take it personal because I'm not

 

            6              personally attacking anybody we just

 

            7              disagree politically on just about

 

            8              everything.

 

            9                      MS. FANUCCI: I agree with you, Bill.

 

           10                      MR. JACKOWITZ: Some will support

 

           11              Mayor Doherty and Councilwoman Gatelli, some

 

           12              will not.  It's as simple as that.  Just

 

           13              because you do not support these incumbent

 

           14              elected officials does not make you a hater.

 

           15              Anybody read the letter to the editor

 

           16              yesterday we are haters.  I don't hate

 

           17              anybody.  I disagree.  Okay, I believe in

 

           18              fair and honest and open --

 

           19                      MS. GATELLI:  You even offered to

 

           20              take me for ham and eggs.

 

           21                      MR. JACKOWITZ: Yes, I did.  I also

 

           22              offered to take you out on the town late at

 

           23              night and you said you were in bed at 9:00

 

           24              every night.

 

           25                      MS. GATELLI:  I told you Joe


 

 

                                                                      35

 

 

            1              wouldn't like that.

 

            2                      MR. JACKOWITZ: I know but anyway --

 

            3              Amil, I'd like to have my stop time here.

 

            4                      MS. GATELLI: At least we can have a

 

            5              conversation.

 

            6                      MR. JACKOWITZ:  I do not feel that

 

            7              Scranton has had that type of government

 

            8              possibly in the entire history of the City

 

            9              of Scranton, that's fair honest and open,

 

           10              okay?  If Sarena was harassed at Scranton

 

           11              city council like she says in her letter by

 

           12              the Legion of Doom I would like for Sarena

 

           13              to contact me at phone number 878-6760.

 

           14              That's 878-6760.

 

           15                      First and foremost, there is no such

 

           16              organization as the Legion of Doom.  I would

 

           17              know since I am the one who started wearing

 

           18              the Legion of Doom shirt and sold over 14

 

           19              dozen of these shirts to Scranton residents.

 

           20              I stopped selling shirts about three years

 

           21              ago, although, I am still getting requests

 

           22              for the shirt.  Legion of Doom, only a

 

           23              t-shirt.  Although, I do not appreciate --

 

           24              excuse me, although I do appreciate the free

 

           25              publicity that my idea and joke still gets.


 

 

                                                                      36

 

 

            1              WILK radio uses Legion of Doom as a lead in

 

            2              into the early morning show, editorials,

 

            3              letters to the editor, all because of a

 

            4              T-shirt and a joke.  Average age of T-shirt

 

            5              buyer is approximately 61 years old.  Mostly

 

            6              retired and lifelong residents of Scranton.

 

            7                      The Single Tax Office breaks tax

 

            8              law.  I quote, "We have had no idea where

 

            9              money goes to, Mr. Stu Renda, Scranton

 

           10              business administrator."

 

           11                      By the way, Mr. Renda gets paid

 

           12              $8,500 a year of taxpayers' money to have no

 

           13              idea where tax money goes to.  Consultant

 

           14              fees for computer system cost $220,000 for

 

           15              what?  The excuse being used is that no one

 

           16              who worked in the tax office knows how to

 

           17              use the computer system, so my question is

 

           18              what were they consulted on?  According to

 

           19              the Times-Tribune the tax office was using

 

           20              taxpayers' money to pay themselves, hire

 

           21              attorneys that are not needed, purchase

 

           22              Mickey Mouse mousepads for the computers

 

           23              that nobody new how to use properly.

 

           24              Purchased mini-blinds, poinsettias, blank

 

           25              CD's, DVD's and optical drives.  A party at


 

 

                                                                      37

 

 

            1              the Stadium Club, office pays.  Air purifier

 

            2              and surveillance camera to watch the workers

 

            3              in the Single Tax Office.  I sure hope they

 

            4              were watching the elected tax collector,

 

            5              also.  Oh, I forgot, he was very rarely in

 

            6              his office.

 

            7                      Admittedly, laws have been broken,

 

            8              Single Tax Law 1929, the bottom line state

 

            9              law was violated when the tax collector, Ken

 

           10              McDowell, combined 17 or so accounts into

 

           11              one account.  This is a violation of state

 

           12              law and a fact that can be proven.  Again,

 

           13              Single Tax Law 1929.  The rest, just a

 

           14              newspaper story.  District Attorney,

 

           15              Council, State Representatives Smith,

 

           16              Murphy, county commissioners, school board,

 

           17              do your job, no selective enforcement.

 

           18              Contact the State Attorney General and start

 

           19              an investigation immediately.

 

           20                      My opinion, the county controllers

 

           21              past and present are also responsible for

 

           22              this debacle at the Single Tax Office.

 

           23              Where were the city controllers, business

 

           24              administrator, mayor, city council, county

 

           25              commissioners, school board, district


 

 

                                                                      38

 

 

            1              attorney and county controllers during this

 

            2              period of time when the Single Tax Office

 

            3              was running amuck.  Can I finish?

 

            4                      Councilwoman Evans, Councilman

 

            5              Courtright and Legion of Doom public

 

            6              speakers were here at city council meetings

 

            7              requesting that someone look into the single

 

            8              tax office.  We were called names such as

 

            9              Legion of Doom.  That is how the name came

 

           10              about, just imagine if the city control,

 

           11              business administrator, mayor, city council,

 

           12              county commissioner, district attorney and

 

           13              county controller and newspaper would have

 

           14              listened.  Possibly the problem would have

 

           15              been discovered three years ago, more than

 

           16              likely it would have been resolved by now

 

           17              and the City of Scranton would be a better

 

           18              place to work, live and play.

 

           19                      Remember, speakers have been

 

           20              arrested, cameras have been removed and

 

           21              speakers searched, wand and made to stand

 

           22              outside in the cold and public television

 

           23              provider has been changed by the mayor and

 

           24              three city council members.  Who gave the

 

           25              order?  We never did find that out.  So,


 

 

                                                                      39

 

 

            1              again, I want to someone to check in this.

 

            2              A law was violated, a law was broken, and

 

            3              it's a state law and district attorney and

 

            4              the State Attorney General should be looking

 

            5              into this matter.  We have a lot of money

 

            6              that is missing.

 

            7                      MS. GATELLI: Thank you.  Mr. Dobson.

 

            8                      MR. DOBSON: Good evening, Council.

 

            9              Dave Dobson, resident of Scranton, member of

 

           10              the Taxpayers' Association.  On these

 

           11              studies, you know, the thought occurred to

 

           12              me that publically funded -- they are

 

           13              publically funded and they're feasibility

 

           14              studies basically and unless somebody

 

           15              screaming at public officials not to do

 

           16              something in a certain way and he goes ahead

 

           17              and does it anyway, maybe some of these

 

           18              people should give us a refund, you know,

 

           19              for their bum studies.

 

           20                      And on this tax office business, one

 

           21              thing that I seem to -- and I'm not entirely

 

           22              certain of, I seem to be seeing here do we

 

           23              still have a single account for every dollar

 

           24              that's flowing in there?  I mean, that's

 

           25              being blamed for the problem and as far as I


 

 

                                                                      40

 

 

            1              can see we have a single -- we have a single

 

            2              account to this day still which that should

 

            3              have been changed as soon as it was taken

 

            4              over and they realized there was a problem.

 

            5              I mean, how many months has it been now?

 

            6                      MS. FANUCCI: They said they had a

 

            7              single account in the beginning, but then

 

            8              when we got our report they had it all

 

            9              itemized in different accounts where the

 

           10              money was, so obviously that was not the

 

           11              issue.  It seems that -- it seems that they

 

           12              weren't even aware that there really wasn't

 

           13              a single account because when we got it all

 

           14              it says all different accounts and where the

 

           15              money was coming, so I'm not sure they even

 

           16              know, to be honest with you.  Even after all

 

           17              is said and done I don't think anyone is

 

           18              anymore enlightened than they were.

 

           19                      MR. DOBSON:  No. Bill, I hope if you

 

           20              make it you've got a good accounting

 

           21              background, Buddy, you are going to need it.

 

           22                      And another thing on this employer

 

           23              deducting taxes and not turning them over, I

 

           24              mean, is somebody going to wind up -- some

 

           25              poor citizen taxpayer turned over to NCC and


 

 

                                                                      41

 

 

            1              be brutalized in that respect and have all

 

            2              kinds of fines and penalties.  It would be

 

            3              interesting to find out who is liable for

 

            4              unpaid taxes that have been deducted because

 

            5              from what I understand in the case of the

 

            6              federal government if your employer deducts

 

            7              taxes and doesn't turn them over you are the

 

            8              one responsible for it.  So, you know, you

 

            9              are liable to have a bunch of people making

 

           10              offers that somebody can't refuse because

 

           11              that's what I probably would be guilty of if

 

           12              somebody did that to me.

 

           13                      On that trash issue last week the

 

           14              man has to thank the DPW for the prompt

 

           15              concern on it, but I'd like to make a

 

           16              comment on that and it involves the

 

           17              people -- there is some people around town,

 

           18              you know, walking out on Tuesday and tossing

 

           19              the bag on the back of your lawn when your

 

           20              trash is picked up Friday just doesn't cut

 

           21              it.  We really need to influence people to

 

           22              stop this because a lot of garbage laying

 

           23              around it's just litter.  It's just garbage

 

           24              that blew away after it was torn up by

 

           25              skunks or whatever.


 

 

                                                                      42

 

 

            1                      And on the PPL on Nay Aug Park now,

 

            2              I attended the open house by PPL last night

 

            3              up in Newton-Ransom and I talked to with a

 

            4              man for quite a bit.  He was actually the

 

            5              head engineer for quite awhile and they

 

            6              couldn't answer my question on spraying of

 

            7              Nay Aug Park on pesticides.  I'd appreciate

 

            8              if you people would try to influence them.

 

            9              It's only an acre or two, keep the

 

           10              herbicides out of Nay Aug Park.  If it leaks

 

           11              over into other trees and sufficient we are

 

           12              going to have a bunch of problems and

 

           13              scorched earth basically.  And when I spoke

 

           14              to him, I mean, these people are really

 

           15              getting bashed every which way over this

 

           16              Roseland project and I mentioned to them

 

           17              some concerns and in the case of Enron they

 

           18              were importing -- they were generating power

 

           19              in California, exporting it out-of-state and

 

           20              charged reimporting it and charging a higher

 

           21              price, that was one of the issues.  Shutting

 

           22              down and -- shutting down power plants and

 

           23              causing brownouts to increase the amount of

 

           24              money coming in and power exported for

 

           25              higher dollars was another issue, so I tried


 

 

                                                                      43

 

 

            1              to convey that to them that some -- that is

 

            2              what some of the Pennsylvania concerns are.

 

            3              We don't really need to have the power --

 

            4              our power that's generated in our

 

            5              neighborhood or our area and shipped out it

 

            6              other states or something that feel they

 

            7              need it more because they can afford to pay

 

            8              a little more money.

 

            9                      The whole idea of regulating the

 

           10              utility years ago was to ensure that they

 

           11              could turn a profit and that they would

 

           12              never, ever have to operate at a loss, so,

 

           13              you know, I just try to get it passed to the

 

           14              guy that, okay, you know, and it goes two

 

           15              ways, so you might want to look into some of

 

           16              those issues.  There is -- down at the

 

           17              library there is a really good article, I'll

 

           18              try to make it brief Enron is smartest guy

 

           19              in the class and it had some really, really

 

           20              good points about what happens when energy

 

           21              and systems are deregulated and people wind

 

           22              up on the roof and wall the way around.  If

 

           23              your refrigerator kicks off there goes your

 

           24              frozen foods again.  Have a good night.

 

           25                      MS. SCHUMACHER: Good evening, two


 

 

                                                                      44

 

 

            1              council persons, Marie Schumacher.

 

            2                      MS. GATELLI: I don't know if she

 

            3              would hearing you.  There is not a quorum

 

            4              here.

 

            5                      MS. SCHUMACHER: You are not voting.

 

            6                      MS. FANUCCI: Can you hear public

 

            7              comment without a quorum?

 

            8                      MS. GATELLI: Can we?

 

            9                      MS. SCHUMACHER: Yeah.

 

           10                      MR.  MINORA: Yes.

 

           11                      MS. SCHUMACHER: Resident and member

 

           12              of the Taxpayers' Association.  Before I get

 

           13              to the remarks I want to make tonight I want

 

           14              to publically thank Mayor Doherty for the

 

           15              wonderful condition of our streets because

 

           16              it caused a bolt -- going over all of these

 

           17              potholes caused a bolt to loosen in my

 

           18              vehicle which happened to give out halfway

 

           19              to church on Sunday and I did not let that

 

           20              ruin the glorious holiday that it was and I

 

           21              hope you all had a glorious Easter and

 

           22              Passover.

 

           23                      This afternoon in Judge Minora's

 

           24              courtroom number three, I heard Mrs. Miller,

 

           25              director of the Genesis Wildlife Center


 

 

                                                                      45

 

 

            1              testify under oath that Mayor Doherty over

 

            2              six years ago came to her private residence

 

            3              in Tobyhanna and asked her to bring her

 

            4              animals to Nay Aug.  Mr. Doherty promised a

 

            5              new facility, a salary and staff and an

 

            6              operating budget.  What did she get after

 

            7              six and a half plus years of patience, an

 

            8              eviction notice.

 

            9                      Further, Mrs. Miller said the city

 

           10              had provided only $150,000 total or an

 

           11              average of $25,000 a year not the $50,000

 

           12              per year we have been reading about in the

 

           13              paper.  Mr. Doherty now says our distressed

 

           14              city cannot afford the wildlife center so I

 

           15              take this as an admission by Mayor Doherty

 

           16              that we are more distressed now than we were

 

           17              in 2003 when he made this offer.

 

           18                      Before I talk more about lies, lies

 

           19              and more lies I want to go back two weeks

 

           20              when I talked at length about the BRT Ice

 

           21              contract with the city.  To refresh, on

 

           22              April 15, 2006, the Scranton Redevelopment

 

           23              Authority executed a resolution that

 

           24              authorized the Redevelopment Contract with

 

           25              BRT Ice Limited Partnership be entered into


 

 

                                                                      46

 

 

            1              and forwarded to the City of Scranton

 

            2              Council as required by the Urban

 

            3              Redevelopment -- excuse me, Urban

 

            4              Redevelopment law for review and approval in

 

            5              regard to the property located in the 800

 

            6              block of Providence Road.

 

            7                      Mrs. Gatelli, at that time you told

 

            8              me you had asked Mr. Minora to review those

 

            9              contracts and see and I would like to give

 

           10              him some of my time.

 

           11                      MR. MINORA:  I had put a call into

 

           12              Attorney Greco, I have spoken to him.  I

 

           13              asked him to review those contracts and give

 

           14              me his opinion since he drafted them on what

 

           15              the obligations are of that.  I haven't

 

           16              heard back from him yet.

 

           17                      MS. GATELLI:  Thank you.

 

           18                      MS. SCHUMACHER: Do you have any idea

 

           19              when we will?  Is there any idea when we

 

           20              will have resolution on this?

 

           21                      MS. GATELLI: We can try to call him

 

           22              again, Amil?

 

           23                      MR. MINORA:  I've just given you

 

           24              what I know.  Anything else would be

 

           25              speculation.


 

 

                                                                      47

 

 

            1                      MS. SCHUMACHER: Thank you.  Okay.

 

            2              Then back to the lies.  We have been told

 

            3              that we live in a progressive city, however,

 

            4              there are cities much smaller than Scranton

 

            5              that use global positioning technology, for

 

            6              instance, to pinpoint the location of every

 

            7              fire hydrant such that firefighters on their

 

            8              way to an incident know which way they

 

            9              should go to have the best access to water.

 

           10              In Scranton, we can't even get the hydrants

 

           11              to be color-coded to denote the water flow.

 

           12                      Mrs. Miller -- again, in the lies

 

           13              theory, Mrs. Miller is not the only person

 

           14              to whom the mayor has lied.  Again, back in

 

           15              November of 2001 the mayor said he would be

 

           16              the sixth council person if he was elected

 

           17              mayor.  In June of 2002, he told the

 

           18              residents there would probably be a tax

 

           19              increase if the Recovery Plan was defeated

 

           20              so the Recovery Plan was approved and we

 

           21              still got a 25 percent tax increase which I

 

           22              predict there will be more to follow.

 

           23                      In October of 2005, one month before

 

           24              the last mayoral election, the mayor

 

           25              announced that a $1.2 million drainage


 

 

                                                                      48

 

 

            1              project on East Elm Street from the

 

            2              Friendship House to Blucher Avenue would be

 

            3              in the next year estimated to be completed

 

            4              in the next year's construction cycle.

 

            5              What's the status?  Four years later, hasn't

 

            6              even been started, although, we have

 

            7              probably spent a fortune as they did on East

 

            8              Mountain Road with surveyor's making it and

 

            9              remarking it.  I'll continue with my lies,

 

           10              lies and more lies next week.  Thank you.

 

           11                      MS. GATELLI: Mr. Schumacher, I did

 

           12              get your note about the rental registration.

 

           13              Mrs. Garvey brought it to my attention and I

 

           14              am inquiring once again --

 

           15                      MS. SCHUMACHER: Thank you.

 

           16                      MS. GATELLI: -- about that.

 

           17                      MS. SCHUMACHER: I look forward to

 

           18              that answer as well.

 

           19                      MS. GATELLI: Mr. Ellman is next.

 

           20                      MR. ELLMAN: Hello, Council.  I'm

 

           21              sorry, I didn't know who I followed.  I

 

           22              don't have much to say.  I had a bunch of

 

           23              people ask me what we named our little baby.

 

           24              We named him Slugo.  No particular reason,

 

           25              just a name.  I have to agree with almost


 

 

                                                                      49

 

 

            1              everybody tonight, which ought to be a earth

 

            2              shaking to you all, but I think one good zoo

 

            3              would probably bring in -- is worth 100

 

            4              Steamtowns.  People will come to a zoo over

 

            5              and over and over, especially children,

 

            6              because I grew up in Memphis which has a

 

            7              beautiful zoo and I couldn't begin to say

 

            8              how many times I went a year with friends to

 

            9              it.  You go to Steamtown once and, you know,

 

           10              it's like going to the Grand Canyon, one

 

           11              time is enough.  You know, but a zoo is

 

           12              something to just -- it just brings families

 

           13              together, you know, and I just love to see

 

           14              one.

 

           15                      You know, all of the money that went

 

           16              down the drain and every time you ask about

 

           17              it they say it's in Nay Aug, but it

 

           18              certainly wasn't in the zoo.  It's a toss up

 

           19              about for me whether they should have closed

 

           20              it or not because I'm an animal lover and I

 

           21              hate to see any kind of animal confined like

 

           22              that, but where there is life there is hope

 

           23              I guess.

 

           24                      You know, to talk about the tax

 

           25              office, I stood here two or three years ago,


 

 

                                                                      50

 

 

            1              four years ago, I don't remember, I got

 

            2              $2,400 floating around there some place.  I

 

            3              have hired two lawyers and they couldn't get

 

            4              any intelligent response from the tax office

 

            5              about my money.  They turned it over to the

 

            6              that NCC and we gave them $2,400 when I

 

            7              still have the paperwork that the bank paid

 

            8              my taxes every year.  I don't know what the

 

            9              trouble is.

 

           10                      One lawyer charged $500 and couldn't

 

           11              get nothing and then I went to the Bureau of

 

           12              the Aging and their attorney didn't charge

 

           13              nothing, but he couldn't get anything from

 

           14              the office.  I have talked to him -- the

 

           15              only intelligent person I ever found over

 

           16              there was Mr. Cox and his expertise wasn't

 

           17              about the money.

 

           18                      I've never been in this Country Club

 

           19              men's store, but I hate to see them go out.

 

           20              I park my car around there sometimes.  I

 

           21              guess Mr. Doherty can make another Irish bar

 

           22              and KOZ the area, you know, like he likes to

 

           23              do.  He needs to KOZ some of the little

 

           24              neighborhood places and put in some Irish

 

           25              bars because there is empty stores all over


 

 

                                                                      51

 

 

            1              the town, you know.  I guess everybody at

 

            2              the Taurus Club gets mad at me for Irish

 

            3              bashing.

 

            4                      MR. COURTRIGHT: Mr. Ellman, I was up

 

            5              there at lunch and you weren't there.

 

            6                      MR. ELLMAN:  Really.

 

            7                      MR. COURTRIGHT: I even went tot he

 

            8              men's room.  I thought you were holding a

 

            9              meeting in there, but you weren't there.

 

           10                      MR. ELLMAN: Did you look on the

 

           11              floor?  I might have been in the bathroom

 

           12              getting some information from somebody.  Our

 

           13              new dog got red eyes.  He goes outside and

 

           14              he is allergic to something so we had to go

 

           15              to the vet yesterday and get him just some

 

           16              lotion to put in his eyes, he is allergic to

 

           17              something, he turned red and comes in the

 

           18              house and he looks good.  Miss Rosie said he

 

           19              looks like he is being sitting up at the

 

           20              Taurus Club with me all evening.

 

           21                      I don't know.  I love animals, but

 

           22              there is a program on Friday nights called

 

           23              Dog Town.  I just donated Lump's wheelchair

 

           24              to them and they wrote me a beautiful letter

 

           25              and sent me some information.  Lump died


 

 

                                                                      52

 

 

            1              before he could use his wheelchair and the

 

            2              people told me I could send it back to them,

 

            3              but I donated it.  I mean, I am just saying

 

            4              I just love animals and I would love to see

 

            5              Mr. Doherty or somebody do something with a

 

            6              zoo.

 

            7                      I could remember, I wasn't real

 

            8              close with my parents like a lot of people

 

            9              because it was the war years and they

 

           10              worked, but I can remember going to the zoo

 

           11              with them just time after time.  Well, I

 

           12              won't waste your time.  Thank you.

 

           13                      MS. GATELLI: Mr. McCloe.  I think

 

           14              you need another dog, Mr. Ellman.

 

           15                      MS. FANUCCI: He just got one this

 

           16              week.

 

           17                      MS. GATELLI: Oh, you got one?

 

           18                      MS. FANUCCI: Last week, yeah.

 

           19                      MR. ELLMAN: You didn't hear about

 

           20              our new addition to the family?

 

           21                      MS. GATELLI: No.

 

           22                      MR. ELLMAN: You need to watch last

 

           23              week's video.

 

           24                      MR. GATELLI:  Mr. Jackowitz is going

 

           25              to get me a copy of it.  I'm sorry,


 

 

                                                                      53

 

 

            1              Mr. McCloe.

 

            2                      MR. MCGOFF: That's okay.  Good

 

            3              evening.  My name is Brett McCloe, Scranton

 

            4              taxpayer, homeowner.  Last week I had made

 

            5              reference to a saying that you can judge a

 

            6              society by how it treats the least of it's

 

            7              citizens.  I just want to say that you can

 

            8              also judge a society by how it treats the

 

            9              best of it's citizens and, no, it's not the

 

           10              business owners and entrepreneurs.  No, it's

 

           11              not the academia and, no, it's not the

 

           12              artists.  Instead, it those who protect and

 

           13              serve the very quality of life that others

 

           14              take for granted, take credit for, and

 

           15              benefit from.

 

           16                      It was also said that fear tactics

 

           17              will become the focus of this year's

 

           18              election.  Police and fire protection has

 

           19              risen to the top of our consciousness.  It's

 

           20              funny how anyone who can blame and criticize

 

           21              the very citizens who protect and serve the

 

           22              public then cite them for the economic

 

           23              problems that face the city.  I, for one,

 

           24              don't know if I have the courage to run into

 

           25              a burning building, the strength to protect


 

 

                                                                      54

 

 

            1              the streets from those who would do the

 

            2              citizens' harm or the speed and knowledge it

 

            3              takes to be first on the scene to revive a

 

            4              still heart.  The price, $26 million.

 

            5              Living to see another day, priceless.

 

            6                      I tried to put some numbers into

 

            7              perspective when talking to a woman at a

 

            8              local grocery store.  294 American soldiers

 

            9              were killed in action in Iraq in 2008.  2008

 

           10              also saw 114 firefighters and 140 police

 

           11              officers lose their lives in the line of

 

           12              duty.  She said all they do is just sit

 

           13              around, why should we pay them for so much

 

           14              down time, as it was their fault that there

 

           15              was no fires.  Ignorant as she was for of

 

           16              her own ignorance, in other words, she

 

           17              didn't care what she didn't know.  It became

 

           18              all to apparent that she was incapable of

 

           19              thinking in more than two dimensions due to

 

           20              her political affiliations.  All she could

 

           21              quote was Mrs. Fanucci's ten-minute gotcha

 

           22              scenario that this is what you get and don't

 

           23              get when you fight city hall.

 

           24                      Once again, I told her the numbers,

 

           25              294 soldiers in Iraq, 254 police and


 

 

                                                                      55

 

 

            1              firefighters in America, 40 lost lives

 

            2              separating the two.  I also wanted her to

 

            3              realize that fire is a force of nature.  It

 

            4              has no politics.  It cannot be bargained

 

            5              with.  It takes no prisoners and absolutely

 

            6              will not stop until it has consumed

 

            7              everything in it's path, including human

 

            8              beings.

 

            9                      Lastly, I told her the next time she

 

           10              sees a firefighter having a sit remember

 

           11              that this might be the last time you ever

 

           12              see that firefighter, that police officer

 

           13              and to think not twice but three times

 

           14              before you try to quantify how much their

 

           15              lives are worth while they stand ready,

 

           16              willing and able to give theirs to save

 

           17              yours.

 

           18                      I just want to everyone to try to

 

           19              understand that there are three sides to

 

           20              every argument just like there are three

 

           21              sides to every coin.  There is heads, there

 

           22              is tails, and then there is the edge.

 

           23              Without the edge, the coin does not exist.

 

           24              I just want everyone to engage in good

 

           25              conversation and above all vote.  Thank you.


 

 

                                                                      56

 

 

            1                      MS. GATELLI: Allison Sayers.

 

            2                      MS. SAYERS: Good evening.  The zoo

 

            3              is on my topic, too.  The zoo was and still

 

            4              is concrete.  It's always been concrete.

 

            5              For six years that was okay.  Now, six years

 

            6              later, the mayor doesn't want it anymore.

 

            7              He wanted the zoo and kept up the pressure

 

            8              until he got what he wanted.  There is

 

            9              nothing in writing of his offer to

 

           10              Mrs. Miller and her husband.  As I said, the

 

           11              zoo was always concrete, but now he doesn't

 

           12              want this zoo and he promised $50,000 a year

 

           13              and apparently she has not been getting that

 

           14              so maybe you want to check that and see

 

           15              where that's been going.

 

           16                      The zoo should stay as is until

 

           17              Mrs. Miller can place the animals, well, at

 

           18              the animal's convenience and that was

 

           19              established this afternoon that they all

 

           20              belonged to her.  She has been paying

 

           21              three-quarters of the expenses for the

 

           22              center and for the animals and some lady

 

           23              comes in from out-of-state and wants them

 

           24              distributed to Texas and every place.  The

 

           25              object is not to have them go into research,


 

 

                                                                      57

 

 

            1              and the three animals that were relocated

 

            2              had to come back.  They had to be sedated.

 

            3              The lynx is a very elderly cat and this is

 

            4              detrimental to the cat's health and she is

 

            5              going to have to be sedated again when she

 

            6              leaves the center and goes to Tobyhanna.

 

            7                      As established at the meeting this

 

            8              afternoon, the animals belong to Mrs.

 

            9              Miller and she should be the only one making

 

           10              the decisions to where they should relocate,

 

           11              which has been established.  The city should

 

           12              meet their obligation until the animals can

 

           13              be relocated by Mrs. Miller at the animal's

 

           14              convenience so that they are not stressed

 

           15              out so she can have them placed ready for

 

           16              them and not have to do work on the area

 

           17              once they are there and so she can move one

 

           18              at a time successfully.

 

           19                      Apparently, there is pressure being

 

           20              put on by the mayor and I have heard rumors

 

           21              about horses at the zoo to replace the

 

           22              animals are there now.  I don't know if this

 

           23              is true or not.

 

           24                      MS. FANUCCI: I think it's just a

 

           25              rumor.


 

 

                                                                      58

 

 

            1                      MS. SAYERS: If this is true or not,

 

            2              but I hope they leave the horses in Waverly.

 

            3              There is lot of cleanup with that and they

 

            4              can mess up the whole park.  I suggest that

 

            5              nothing else be established in this spot for

 

            6              at least five years.  Maybe it would be good

 

            7              to tear it down, too, and also the aviary

 

            8              which is across from the zoo.

 

            9                      Going onto the tax collector job, I

 

           10              don't understand why it's elected.  Many

 

           11              positions in New Jersey where I was a

 

           12              municipal auditor these places are -- people

 

           13              are placed by civil service exam.  That

 

           14              means that somebody has to know the laws,

 

           15              they have to know what to do when they are

 

           16              in there.  It's not going to be somebody

 

           17              that doesn't come from an adequate

 

           18              background.  I don't know what

 

           19              Mr. Courtright's background is, but I will

 

           20              be looking seriously into your campaign

 

           21              flyers.

 

           22                      MS. FANUCCI:  Well, I just want to

 

           23              tell you that's a state law so that would

 

           24              have to be done on a state level to change

 

           25              that.  We are obligated to have an election


 

 

                                                                      59

 

 

            1              to have a tax collector right now.

 

            2                      MS. SAYERS:  Well, it would be

 

            3              something to look into.  It would benefit

 

            4              the whole state, but Scranton definitely

 

            5              needs it, and what happened to an audit

 

            6              every year, that's not required?

 

            7                      MR. COURTRIGHT: It is.

 

            8                      MS. FANUCCI:  It is required.

 

            9                      MS. SAYERS:  Whatever happened to

 

           10              it?  Everybody says, well, I didn't know.

 

           11              Where I came from in New Jersey they had

 

           12              somebody donate money for a pool and it was

 

           13              -- the money was invested for keeping the

 

           14              pool up and all that they were allowed to

 

           15              charge people was for the waterproof badge.

 

           16              And on herbicides, that bothers a lot of

 

           17              people.  They say, "Oh, it's safe."

 

           18                      It's not safe.  I have family

 

           19              members that when they use them up in Wayne

 

           20              County where she lives they have to give her

 

           21              a week's notice so she can clear out.  Thank

 

           22              you.

 

           23                      MS. GATELLI: Phyllis.

 

           24                      MS. HUMPHRIES: Pacha.  Freta.

 

           25              Salaam aleikum and shalom, and peace.  But


 

 

                                                                      60

 

 

            1              the true peace is coming when Jesus Christ

 

            2              comes.  You know, hacking of computers?  My

 

            3              computer was hacked in, but it was somebody

 

            4              that wanted to enlighten me about the City

 

            5              of Scranton.  First it went to Mayor Connors

 

            6              --  or excuse me, not Mayor Connors, it went

 

            7              to Mayor Doherty and I really wanted to know

 

            8              how the system worked and the mayor has

 

            9              override of a lot of the officials with the

 

           10              police department, District Attorney's

 

           11              Office and, oh, that's very interesting.

 

           12              Then I went to -- it went to -- and I'm

 

           13              standing there watching this to stuntmen

 

           14              mayor.  It had to do with movies about that

 

           15              they put here for the festival which Mrs.

 

           16              Gatelli was on, Rabbi Mendelson that I gave

 

           17              him documents to go to Israel, Monsignor

 

           18              Quinn.  It's kind of funny, but it's kind of

 

           19              like of shocking while I was watching this.

 

           20                      There is a law which I told, and

 

           21              everybody knows here, and that lawyer, judge

 

           22              or whatever he represents here is very much

 

           23              aware of.  We have our civil rights, we have

 

           24              the United States constitution in America

 

           25              and we have the Geneva Convention.  Most


 

 

                                                                      61

 

 

            1              people did a lot of crimes against me, some

 

            2              police falsified documents here, which

 

            3              medical would show evidently different.  Did

 

            4              you ever hear -- I saved the turkey last

 

            5              year, the turkey bones and I paint on them.

 

            6              There is a Prince turkey from Riyadh.  He is

 

            7              with the central intelligence.  Are you

 

            8              familiar with him, Mrs. Gatelli?

 

            9                      MS. GATELLI: No.

 

           10                      MS. HUMPHRIES: But I know Monsignor

 

           11              Quinn is.  In church, after the Holy

 

           12              Communion is when the fullest spirit

 

           13              desantis is in you and I could get messages.

 

           14              They had a write up in the paper about

 

           15              people that went to the church and pulling

 

           16              out, but numerous people ran to talk to my

 

           17              best friend, lay down your life for your

 

           18              best friend, Sally Thompson and Mariette.

 

           19              They go back constantly, causing problems,

 

           20              which breaks the ecumenical reconciliation

 

           21              of the churches.

 

           22                      My car was flattened.  Months ago

 

           23              was my daughter was ran off the road

 

           24              thinking it was me, that she is lucky she is

 

           25              alive.


 

 

                                                                      62

 

 

            1                      Yesterday, I called the President of

 

            2              the United States because of me filing

 

            3              papers with the civil rights they blocked

 

            4              everything here in the City of Scranton to

 

            5              not go any further to the proper people to

 

            6              protect our country and with the Geneva

 

            7              Convention it not only protection of

 

            8              enemies, it's the protection of the

 

            9              civilians in time of war.

 

           10                      My family has been affected by what

 

           11              has been affected and abuse of me.  Some of

 

           12              the police are afraid to say anything and

 

           13              they are afraid of losing their jobs, so now

 

           14              it's like buckaroo cleanup at the corral.

 

           15              Rendell, Hillary Clinton, I wrote them

 

           16              letters prior top them coming into office

 

           17              and Casey and to no avail did they help me,

 

           18              but truly they don't even help the unborn.

 

           19                      I ask everybody to listen to what

 

           20              I'm saying, Scranton Counseling Center

 

           21              misdiagnosed me and the corruption is going

 

           22              to go from Judge Robinson who is deceased

 

           23              all the way up to the president and this is

 

           24              not a threat, this is a promise.  When you

 

           25              got to clean up, you got to clean up no


 

 

                                                                      63

 

 

            1              matter what, so I hope to God everybody does

 

            2              listen to this.  Somebody stopped me, this

 

            3              Jimmy said, "You know what," he says, "You

 

            4              are so much fun and the city council loves

 

            5              you," and he says, "you are the last one on

 

            6              and you bring like kind of like a fun, but

 

            7              you tell the truth what's going on that

 

            8              everybody is afraid of."

 

            9                      Monica and Diana, I won't say their

 

           10              last name, Bob, Jim, you are going to be

 

           11              arrested.  You are not going to tell me to

 

           12              go to another country.

 

           13                      MS. GATELLI: Thanks, Phyllis.  Thank

 

           14              you.

 

           15                      MS. HUMPHRIES: I want them to know,

 

           16              they can't tell nobody to go to another

 

           17              country when I'm a United States citizen,

 

           18              Italian, Polish, Czechoslovakian, Austrian

 

           19              descent.  I have family in Russia, I have

 

           20              family in Japan.  I have family all over

 

           21              different countries and my family and my

 

           22              families and some of these people are being

 

           23              affected.  I have my daughter-in-law's

 

           24              mother is visiting from Russia right now.

 

           25              So when you are dealing with me and hurting


 

 

                                                                      64

 

 

            1              me you are hurting these countries all the

 

            2              way to Rome.

 

            3                      And the other thing I have to say

 

            4              it's disgusting the way they treat Bishop

 

            5              Martino, it's appalling.  It's appalling.

 

            6                      MR. COURTRIGHT: Phyllis, your time

 

            7              is up.

 

            8                      MS. GATELLI: Thank you, Phyllis.

 

            9                      MS. HUMPHRIES:  My time is not up,

 

           10              everybody else's time is up.  You know, I

 

           11              looked at recipe and it had ham butt and a

 

           12              bone is a curse and a bone could be a

 

           13              blessing so ping pong to everybody.

 

           14                      MS. GATELLI: Is there anyone else?

 

           15              By the way, there is a ping pong tournament

 

           16              on Saturday.  Mayor Connors will be down

 

           17              there with his paddle.

 

           18                      MS. HUMPHRIES: I just hope him to

 

           19              get the first two paddles.

 

           20                      MR. GERVASI: Good evening, City

 

           21              Council.  I really had nothing else to say

 

           22              until, Mrs. Fanucci, I know you get mad at

 

           23              me sometimes when I don't pay attention to

 

           24              you, but I had your -- I was very attentive

 

           25              last week at the end of the meeting during


 

 

                                                                      65

 

 

            1              motions when you were talking about the

 

            2              health care situation.  I think you miss the

 

            3              point.  I don't think there is any city

 

            4              employees that are actually complaining

 

            5              about the health care increases or what the

 

            6              amount is, we are really not because it's

 

            7              not that bad, the point is that we shouldn't

 

            8              be paying that and there is a good reason

 

            9              for it.  Let me give you a little history

 

           10              lesson on the health care, because it seems

 

           11              like everybody is trying to divide, well,

 

           12              the city employees are paying this much and

 

           13              everybody else has to pay a lot more.  How

 

           14              you can you understand the whole situation.

 

           15                      MS. FANUCCI: I think I do, but let's

 

           16              go.

 

           17                      MR. GERVASI: Let's go.

 

           18                      MS. FANUCCI: Go ahead.

 

           19                      MR. GERVASI:  1992 the first

 

           20              Recovery Plan, obviously health care was a

 

           21              problem, it was rising even back then.  The

 

           22              state said that we were going to have a

 

           23              health care cost containment committee when

 

           24              the employees for the first time ever, the

 

           25              employees would sit with the city and go


 

 

                                                                      66

 

 

            1              against the insurance companies and try to

 

            2              get the best deal, and that's what happened.

 

            3                      Now, there was problems, the city

 

            4              wasn't cooperating at the time during the

 

            5              90's and finally, finally, we went to Court

 

            6              I believe in 1993 or '94 I wasn't on the

 

            7              board at the time, it was my predecessors

 

            8              that were on that committee, I believe Nancy

 

            9              Krake was there from the beginning, she

 

           10              would probably know this a lot better than

 

           11              me the history of it.  At that time we

 

           12              actually had to force the city through an

 

           13              arbitration to sit down with us because our

 

           14              health care premiums were going up and our

 

           15              copays and our contributions were going and

 

           16              up, but because of our contract language we

 

           17              had the opportunity to lower our health

 

           18              care, change our health care provider, do

 

           19              all kind of sort of things like that to

 

           20              lower the costs because it was -- it was a

 

           21              benefit for us, too, because while we saved

 

           22              the city money, which is saving the

 

           23              taxpayers' money, we saved ourselves higher

 

           24              copays and contributions, so things were a

 

           25              little rocky for the first few years.


 

 

                                                                      67

 

 

            1                      Once we forced the city to sit down

 

            2              and partner with us we knocked off

 

            3              $2 million in health care costs in one year.

 

            4              That was Blue Cross at the time.  While that

 

            5              process was taking place we did an audit, it

 

            6              was Heffler Company, did an audit, they came

 

            7              back with a cursory audit that showed that

 

            8              the city was dumping 33 percent of all of

 

            9              the claims, comp claims for work-related

 

           10              injuries into our health care provider was

 

           11              paying them.

 

           12                      Now, if you know anything about

 

           13              health care what they do is every year a

 

           14              health care provider will come back to the

 

           15              city, and it's based on your experience,

 

           16              which is basically how much you used the

 

           17              year before and that's how they base what

 

           18              you premiums are going to be the following

 

           19              year.  Because there was 33 percent dumped

 

           20              into comp, which should have been taken care

 

           21              of from the comp carrier, would that cursory

 

           22              audit that was done we then went to the city

 

           23              and said, "We were overcharged in

 

           24              contributions and copays," and the city, the

 

           25              taxpayers were overcharged, so we began --


 

 

                                                                      68

 

 

            1              the city, of course, didn't do anything

 

            2              about it.  We forced them in Court again to

 

            3              did a proper audit, a complete audit so we

 

            4              could find out the exact numbers so we would

 

            5              know how to proceed and get a benchmark and

 

            6              at that point now how to proceed.

 

            7                      The Doherty administration came in,

 

            8              they fired the auditing company, that's a

 

            9              fact, they fired our health care consultants

 

           10              which in 2000, I believe '99 or 2000, with

 

           11              no help from the state, with no help from

 

           12              the Pennsylvania Economy League, the unions,

 

           13              the DPW and the clerical, the fire and the

 

           14              police unions took the city to Court again

 

           15              and forced the city to do what the health

 

           16              care cost containment language said.  At

 

           17              that time we had a good consultant and we

 

           18              lopped off $5 million off of our health

 

           19              care, and at that time our health care

 

           20              contributions and copays went away for like

 

           21              three years.  We went self-insured.

 

           22                      Mr. Doherty fired that consultant

 

           23              that we had that was legally and

 

           24              contractually mandated that the city has.

 

           25              For the next few years nothing happened.  We


 

 

                                                                      69

 

 

            1              had a few health care meetings, nothing

 

            2              happened.  We would have a few meetings, we

 

            3              would come in, the HR department would be

 

            4              there --

 

            5                      MS. FANUCCI: What years are we at

 

            6              now, I just want to get --

 

            7                      MR. GERVASI: These years were

 

            8              probably 2003 -- two, three, four, in the

 

            9              beginning of the Doherty administration.

 

           10                      MS. FANUCCI: Okay.

 

           11                      MR. GERVASI:  We found out that the

 

           12              censuses were wrong, there was deceased

 

           13              people still on our books.  There was people

 

           14              that were in the wrong what they call

 

           15              buckets, there was retirees and active

 

           16              lists, there was actives and retiree lists,

 

           17              to make a long story short we are not

 

           18              complaining about what we pay in

 

           19              contributions to health care.  What we are

 

           20              complaining about --

 

           21                      MS. FANUCCI: I know you are not.  Go

 

           22              ahead.

 

           23                      MS. GERVASI: You shouldn't either

 

           24              because you pay less than us.

 

           25                      MS. FANUCCI: I do not.


 

 

                                                                      70

 

 

            1                      MS. GERVASI: Sure you do.

 

            2                      MS. FANUCCI: No, I don't.

 

            3                      MR. GERVASI: I'll bring that next

 

            4              week and I'll show it.

 

            5                      MS. FANUCCI:  You should.  You

 

            6              should because you are absolutely incorrect.

 

            7                      MR. GERVASI: Okay.

 

            8                      MR. FANUCCI: And I referred a lot of

 

            9              paperwork, but, go ahead.

 

           10                      MR. GERVASI:  But the point I'm

 

           11              trying to make is, and over my time, the

 

           12              point I'm trying to make is we are not

 

           13              complaining what we pay.  What we are

 

           14              complaining about is the city did not

 

           15              cooperate with us.  We had our first health

 

           16              care cost containment meeting in two, two

 

           17              and a half years.  There was a whole bunch

 

           18              of things that we are going to do with our

 

           19              new consultant and, frankly, at this point

 

           20              the seven judges that just decided that

 

           21              Court order that the mayor is touting that

 

           22              the city somehow won they also upheld our

 

           23              cost containment language.

 

           24                      MS. FANUCCI:  Yes.

 

           25                      MR. GERVASI:  So don't try to say


 

 

                                                                      71

 

 

            1              the city employees are complaining about

 

            2              copays going up when the city is

 

            3              responsible, the mayor and the HR director

 

            4              is responsible for any increases that

 

            5              happened over the last five years because

 

            6              they did not cooperate with us.

 

            7                      MS. FANUCCI: Okay, but I was not

 

            8              saying you did not say that that was not

 

            9              okay, what I was referring to was

 

           10              Mr. Ancherani coming up here and saying, "I

 

           11              have a person whose health care went up --"

 

           12              how many percent did you say at the time?

 

           13                      MR. ANCHERANI: 1,100.

 

           14                      MS. FANUCCI: And that's what I was

 

           15              referring to, that it did go up that

 

           16              percentage and what you were paying and what

 

           17              you were paying now, so actually I was just

 

           18              giving accurate information.  I did not say

 

           19              you were up here complaining about it, I was

 

           20              saying that Ancherani said that somebody's

 

           21              health care went up --

 

           22                      MR. GERVASI: We weren't.

 

           23                      MS. FANUCCI: And that's exactly what

 

           24              I said.

 

           25                      MR. GERVASI:  The point I'm trying


 

 

                                                                      72

 

 

            1              to make is this, it did go up.  The point

 

            2              I'm trying to make is this --

 

            3                      MS. FANUCCI:  Yes, it did.

 

            4                      MR. GERVASI:  We are not complaining

 

            5              what it's at, we are complaining where it

 

            6              should be.  We are complaining where it

 

            7              should be because the city has not

 

            8              cooperated with us.

 

            9                      MS. FANUCCI:  So you believe you are

 

           10              paying too much now as -- you are

 

           11              contributing too much to your health care,

 

           12              it's at your cap?

 

           13                      MR. GERVASI: Absolutely, because

 

           14              what you need to know is --

 

           15                      MS. FANUCCI: Okay.

 

           16                      MR. GERVASI:  Is the equivalent of

 

           17              the health care that we have.  I'm done now.

 

           18              The level of health care we have right now

 

           19              if you pay the premium to Blue Cross for

 

           20              that health care you would paying $14,900 a

 

           21              year.  The taxpayers are not paying that

 

           22              much.  As a matter of fact, I think we are

 

           23              still around the cap which is probably about

 

           24              $8,000 for the exact same health care that's

 

           25              because of the Health Care Committee.


 

 

                                                                      73

 

 

            1              That's because of the Health Care Committee.

 

            2                      MS. GATELLI: We need the Health Care

 

            3              Committee up the street.

 

            4                      MR. GERVASI:  Yes, you did, because

 

            5              that's what you are paying, that's the

 

            6              taxpayers are paying for your health care,

 

            7              $14,900 and we're in the same as Access

 

            8              Care-II.  We have the exact same thing as

 

            9              what you have except we are paying probably

 

           10              only 60 percent of that.

 

           11                      MS. GATELLI: Thank you.

 

           12                      MR. GERVASI:  That's the point.

 

           13                      MS. CYPRUS: Good evening.  My name

 

           14              is Mrs. Ellen Cyprus and this is my first

 

           15              time before council.  I actually come here

 

           16              this evening because I have a concern and I

 

           17              want to voice my opinion with regard to the

 

           18              Genesis Center up at Nay Aug.  I find it

 

           19              very distasteful that someone who is not

 

           20              from the area had had so much to say about

 

           21              the place, and from what I understand she

 

           22              has only seen the place on a couple of

 

           23              occasions and to come forth and make all of

 

           24              these allegations and to create such

 

           25              pandemonium is quite outrageous.  Ms.


 

 

                                                                      74

 

 

            1              Heveran also claims to have been on the

 

            2              Board of the New England Zoo, however, I

 

            3              have heard claims that no one there has ever

 

            4              heard of her.  If she is concerned with the

 

            5              Genesis Center and the welfare of these

 

            6              animals she should be using all of this

 

            7              dedicated effort seeing what she could do in

 

            8              the way of help, financially or any other

 

            9              way, rather than just spewing all of this

 

           10              negativity an creating an uproar, disrupting

 

           11              people's lives and causing all kinds of

 

           12              grief.

 

           13                      To often, people have agendas.  They

 

           14              don't fully realize what the result of the

 

           15              outcome would be.  They satisfy and placate

 

           16              themselves believing they have done the

 

           17              right thing and when all is said and done

 

           18              all they have really done is to displace yet

 

           19              again more victims of their agenda who this

 

           20              time began at the Genesis Center.  It takes

 

           21              a lot of time and effort to be able to

 

           22              accomplish what Margaret has done and

 

           23              winning over the confidence and trust of her

 

           24              charges.  Animals do not adopt as readily as

 

           25              humans and when those animals have other


 

 

                                                                      75

 

 

            1              psychological issues it is even more

 

            2              distressing for them.

 

            3                      I understand that the Genesis Center

 

            4              was promised a lot of help and other things

 

            5              by the city when they first came here and

 

            6              I'm sure a lot of these promises were made,

 

            7              if they were made good on, would have a very

 

            8              positive affect on the center and,

 

            9              obviously, improve a lot of the issues and

 

           10              concern.  Rather than ousting the Genesis

 

           11              Center, I think it would be more prudent to

 

           12              make good on the promises that were offered

 

           13              in the beginning and allow them to remain

 

           14              here.

 

           15                      I am a financial response or of the

 

           16              animals and have volunteered my time also to

 

           17              help.  The bottom line is the city just

 

           18              needed to step up to the plate.  The Genesis

 

           19              Center may not be the ideal or the perfect

 

           20              place in comparison to other noteworthy zoos

 

           21              and sanctuaries, but for the animals it

 

           22              houses it's a God send and a vast

 

           23              improvement from whence they came.  Even

 

           24              though it's not a pretty sanctuary, the love

 

           25              and care these animals get far surpasses the


 

 

                                                                      76

 

 

            1              loss.  They are well-fed, warm and

 

            2              protected, and speaking of protection, to my

 

            3              knowledge there is no validity to Mrs.

 

            4              Heveran's claim of public endangerment.  On

 

            5              all of occasions that I have been there, not

 

            6              one time did I see or feel that the public

 

            7              would be in danger in any way.  There are

 

            8              barriers that keep the public at bay by a

 

            9              good distance and other safeguards in place

 

           10              as well.

 

           11                      This is the last stop for most of

 

           12              these animals there.  Let them live in

 

           13              peace, they don't need another mart.  And I

 

           14              want to talk about a footnote to this

 

           15              because it has come to my attention that as

 

           16              a result of the hearing today that she has

 

           17              decided to move back to Tobyhanna.  I think

 

           18              it's ashame.  I think it's a disgrace.  It's

 

           19              really just more proverbial egg on the face

 

           20              of the city.  I think the fact that Mrs.

 

           21              Heveran stepped in here, she has only moved

 

           22              in here relatively recently and come from a

 

           23              different state and her claim to fame now is

 

           24              totally dissolving the sanctuary.  What a

 

           25              wonderful thing.  What a wonderful epitate


 

 

                                                                      77

 

 

            1              for someone to have.  I think it's ashame.

 

            2                      This woman came here, made a great

 

            3              deal of effort to move here all of these

 

            4              years ago, was made promises to, they

 

            5              weren't seen through.  I just think it's a

 

            6              damn shame.  Thank you.

 

            7                      MS. KRAKE: Good evening, Council.

 

            8              My name is Nancy Krake.  Last week

 

            9              Mrs. Fanucci said that the mayor alone is

 

           10              not responsible for the financial trouble

 

           11              the city is in, and I agree 100 percent.

 

           12              One man alone could not have caused this

 

           13              financial disaster.  Mrs. Fanucci, you and

 

           14              Mrs. Gatelli are two of the three

 

           15              accomplices to this crime against the

 

           16              citizenry while the mayor himself said all

 

           17              he needs is three votes.  Mrs. Fanucci, Mrs.

 

           18              Gatelli and Mr. McGoff are the three votes

 

           19              that gave the mayor the license to borrow

 

           20              and tax us more in these eight years than

 

           21              ever before in the history of this city.

 

           22                      MS. GATELLI:  We are the only three.

 

           23              I'm sorry.

 

           24                      MS. KRAKE:  That's quite all right.

 

           25                      MS. GATELLI:  But I can't be quiet


 

 

                                                                      78

 

 

            1              when are you telling the whole truth, Nancy.

 

            2              We are only here three years.  You are

 

            3              talking about from 2002, there were other

 

            4              people here that borrowed money, too.

 

            5                      MS. KRAKE: I'm sorry that's how you

 

            6              feel, but I'm talking about --

 

            7                      MS. GATELLI: Oh, no, I --

 

            8                      MS. KRAKE: I'm talking about actual

 

            9              votes.

 

           10                      MS. GATELLI:  Tell the truth.  Mr.

 

           11              DiBileo borrowed money, too, and so did

 

           12              Mr. Courtright.  I'll bring statistics next

 

           13              week.

 

           14                      MS. KRAKE: If you are finished --

 

           15                      MS. GATELLI: I don't think it's fair

 

           16              that you are only blaming certain people

 

           17              when we are only here three years of the

 

           18              eight.

 

           19                      MS. KRAKE: Are you finished?

 

           20                      MS. GATELLI: Go ahead.

 

           21                      MS. KRAKE:  Are you finished.

 

           22                      MS. GATELLI: For now I am.

 

           23                      MS. KRAKE:  You are?  Thank you.  I

 

           24              was speaking concerning how three people

 

           25              have voted during their terms.  If you can't


 

 

                                                                      79

 

 

            1              understand that, that's okay.  It's not okay

 

            2              for the taxpayers, but it's okay for you

 

            3              because you are running again so you

 

            4              obviously are very okay with how you have

 

            5              voted.

 

            6                      MS. GATELLI:  Yes, I am.

 

            7                      MS. KRAKE: We didn't just magically

 

            8              fall into a recession -- oh.  We did not

 

            9              just magically fall into a recession.

 

           10              Mrs. Fanucci, Mrs. Gatelli caused this

 

           11              city's recession.  You raised the taxes

 

           12              27 percent and you borrowed the millions

 

           13              that buried us under a mountain of debt.

 

           14                      I agree, Mayor Doherty didn't cause

 

           15              this financial distress alone.  Mrs. Fanucci

 

           16              and Mrs. Gatelli have left the taxpayers

 

           17              holding the bag and apparently they are not

 

           18              aware of it.  Thank you.

 

           19                      MS. GATELLI: Hello, Mrs. Franus.

 

           20                      MS. FRANUS: Fay Franus, Scranton.

 

           21              What I'm saying tonight is a matter of fact,

 

           22              it's my opinion.  I agree with Mrs. Krake

 

           23              completely.  I can't -- Judy, I can't get

 

           24              over this charade this last couple of months

 

           25              with you running for election.  All this


 

 

                                                                      80

 

 

            1              sweetness and sugar.  I'm gaining wait just

 

            2              listening to you.  I can't even comprehend

 

            3              this.  Where is the other Judy Gatelli that

 

            4              I knew.

 

            5                      MS. FANUCCI: When you are not here,

 

            6              right?

 

            7                      MS. FRANUS: What's that?

 

            8                      MS. FANUCCI: You guys go at when you

 

            9              are here.  When you are not here she doesn't

 

           10              have to go at it as much maybe.

 

           11                      MS. FRANUS:  Well, the point is I'm

 

           12              stating the facts here.  Where is that other

 

           13              person?  The one that raised the taxes

 

           14              25 percent and told me they don't represent

 

           15              me.  The one that had me taken out by police

 

           16              twice and the one that had the people

 

           17              standing outside for weeks and weeks and had

 

           18              people scanned.  What about the lawsuit that

 

           19              you had with the website that the taxpayers

 

           20              are paying.  Nancy Krake asked that question

 

           21              last week but I didn't hear an answer.  The

 

           22              taxpayers are paying.

 

           23                      MS. GATELLI: I'll answer all of this

 

           24              in motions.

 

           25                      MS. FRANUS: Well, I'm asking you to


 

 

                                                                      81

 

 

            1              answer it now.  Are you -- are you --

 

            2              because I can answer you what you are

 

            3              saying.  We went to Court and you didn't say

 

            4              anything.  You were filing as a private

 

            5              citizen and the taxpayers are paying for it.

 

            6                      MS. GATELLI: No, they are not.

 

            7                      MS. FRANUS:  Yes, they are.

 

            8                      MS. GATELLI: No, they are not.

 

            9                      MS. FRANUS: Okay.  Well --

 

           10                      MS. GATELLI: They are not paying for

 

           11              the private action, and I was sued first,

 

           12              Mrs. Franus.  It's a countersuit.

 

           13                      MS. FRANUS:  But here's my point --

 

           14                      MS. GATELLI:  They are not paying my

 

           15              private lawsuit.  No, they are not.

 

           16                      MS. FRANUS: Way back then --

 

           17                      MS. GATELLI: You are lying again.

 

           18                      MS. FRANUS: I'm not lying.

 

           19                      MS. GATELLI: You are lying because

 

           20              it's not true.

 

           21                      MS. FRANUS:  Well, maybe it isn't,

 

           22              but we will find out.  Maybe I'm wrong and I

 

           23              will find out.

 

           24                      MS. GATELLI: Well --

 

           25                      MS. FRANUS: I may even admit that.


 

 

                                                                      82

 

 

            1              That could be true.

 

            2                      MS. GATELLI:  Mr. Minora will tell

 

            3              you, you can't pay for a private action.

 

            4                      MS. FRANUS:  Okay, that's fine.

 

            5                      MS. GATELLI: Not true.

 

            6                      MS. FRANUS:  Okay.  I'll go along

 

            7              with that, but my point is this, all those

 

            8              things that were said in that website that

 

            9              you had so distraught they are still saying

 

           10              them on the website every day --

 

           11                      MS. GATELLI: No, they are not.  No,

 

           12              they are not.

 

           13                      MS. FRANUS: Well --

 

           14                      MS. GATELLI: They don't have guns on

 

           15              there with heads blowing off.

 

           16                      MS. FRANUS:  That's just an avatar.

 

           17                      MS. GATELLI: I don't have any more

 

           18              broken windshields and I have no more flat

 

           19              tires.

 

           20                      MS. FRANUS: The people still feel

 

           21              the same way about you, Judy.

 

           22                      MS. GATELLI:  Yes, I know, and you

 

           23              probably one of the posters on there.

 

           24                      MS. FRANUS: Well, there we go.

 

           25                      MS. GATELLI: So you are defending


 

 

                                                                      83

 

 

            1              bullying people.

 

            2                      MS. FRANUS:  This is freedom of

 

            3              speech.

 

            4                      MS. GATELLI: You are defending

 

            5              bullying people.

 

            6                      MS. FRANUS: I'm defending freedom of

 

            7              speech.

 

            8                      MS. GATELLI: Douglas said about

 

            9              bullies, well, that was what happened to

 

           10              me --

 

           11                      MS. FRANUS: See, this is what you --

 

           12                      MS. GATELLI: And people came to the

 

           13              podium to the defend that.  They thought it

 

           14              was okay to have a gun on there blowing my

 

           15              head off.

 

           16                      MS. FRANUS:  And you were blowing

 

           17              that out of proportion.  It's an --

 

           18                      MS. GATELLI:  No, I'm not.

 

           19                      MS. FRANUS: Yes, you are.  The

 

           20              avatar is on there, that doesn't mean

 

           21              anything.  That doesn't mean anything.

 

           22                      MS. GATELLI:  Well, the district

 

           23              attorney and the chief of police thought it

 

           24              was.

 

           25                      MS. FRANUS:  Well, they are all


 

 

                                                                      84

 

 

            1              wrong.  These are avatars.  There is other

 

            2              avatars on there that --

 

            3                      MS. GATELLI:  I know.  Everyone is

 

            4              wrong.

 

            5                      MS. FRANUS: No, you are wrong.

 

            6                      MS. GATELLI: Everyone is wrong.

 

            7                      MS. FRANUS: You are the reason we

 

            8              had the 25 percent increase in the NCC where

 

            9              people may lose their homes --

 

           10                      MS. GATELLI:  The city budget is

 

           11              only 17 percent.  The school board --

 

           12                      MS. FRANUS:  Judy, how about NCC

 

           13              that you voted for and people may lose their

 

           14              homes for.

 

           15                      MS. GATELLI: People -- no one lost

 

           16              their homes.

 

           17                      MS. FRANUS: Doesn't mean they're not

 

           18              going to.  How about the lines that they

 

           19              painted because you voted for that?

 

           20                      MS. GATELLI: No one has lost their

 

           21              homes.  You are lying again, Mrs. Franus.

 

           22              Why are you lying?

 

           23                      MS. FRANUS: I'm an --

 

           24                      MS. GATELLI: -- is that why you're

 

           25              lying?


 

 

                                                                      85

 

 

            1                      MS. FRANUS: I'm not lying.

 

            2                      (Whereupon part of the following

 

            3              exchange between Mrs. Gatelli and Mrs.

 

            4              Franus became unreportable.)

 

            5                      MS. GATELLI: Why are you

 

            6              discrediting me --

 

            7                      MS. FRANUS: You know --

 

            8                      MS. GATELLI:  You discredit me in

 

            9              this community --

 

           10                      MS. FRANUS: Because --

 

           11                      MS. GATELLI: I volunteered for 28

 

           12              years of my life --

 

           13                      MS. FRANUS: Janet Evans and Gary

 

           14              DiBileo --

 

           15                      MS. GATELLI: -- because you say so

 

           16              about me --

 

           17                      MS. FRANUS: -- every part they went

 

           18              to you sit up on the stage and griped your

 

           19              hands with them.

 

           20                      MS. GATELLI: I would have been --

 

           21                      (Whereupon the exchange between Mrs.

 

           22              Gatelli and Mrs. Franus became

 

           23              unreportable.)

 

           24                      MS. GATELLI: They are liars.

 

           25                      MS. FRANUS: And you are liar because


 

 

                                                                      86

 

 

            1              you said you were with Janet and Gary and

 

            2              you never were.  You were with Mayor Doherty

 

            3              all along.  You just wanted to get the

 

            4              votes.

 

            5                      MS. GATELLI: No, I wasn't.  No, I

 

            6              wasn't.

 

            7                      MR. FRANUS: You want to see the

 

            8              videos of any of those parties?

 

            9                      MS. GATELLI: I'm on my own, Mrs.

 

           10              Franus.

 

           11                      MS. FRANUS: Then why were you at

 

           12              every at party with Janet and Gary?

 

           13                      MS. GATELLI: I was --

 

           14                      MS. FRANUS: You weren't there then.

 

           15                      MS. GATELLI: The commercial --

 

           16                      MS. FRANUS: But you voted for

 

           17              everything Mayor Doherty wanted.

 

           18                      MS. GATELLI: Yeah, because it helps

 

           19              the community.

 

           20                      MS. FRANUS: Raising the taxes is

 

           21              helping the community when you had 12

 

           22              million dollars in the --

 

           23                      MS. GATELLI: -- 55 a month --

 

           24                      MS. FRANUS:  But you got a service,

 

           25              Mrs. Gatelli.  You got a service.  You are


 

 

                                                                      87

 

 

            1              getting water for that money.  What are we

 

            2              getting for the taxes that we are paying?

 

            3              Nothing.  That you give us.  You.  25

 

            4              percent and the NCC and everything else, all

 

            5              of the borrowing, and what about that, Mrs.

 

            6              Gatelli?

 

            7                      MS. GATELLI: How about all of the

 

            8              money that Mr. DiBileo borrowed.

 

            9                      MS. FRANUS: What kind of service --

 

           10              who?

 

           11                      MS. GATELLI: Mr. DiBileo.  He

 

           12              borrowed a lot of money.

 

           13                      MS. FRANUS: I'm talking about you.

 

           14              I'm not saying that was right.

 

           15                      MS. GATELLI: Yeah, I know you are

 

           16              talking about me.

 

           17                      MS. FRANUS: Gary DiBileo should not

 

           18              have done that either and I agree.

 

           19                      MS. GATELLI: Well, he did?

 

           20                      MS. FRANUS: Well, and he shouldn't

 

           21              have and I absolutely agree.

 

           22                      MS. GATELLI: He was here a lot

 

           23              longer than I was.

 

           24                      MS. FRANUS: And I agree with you.

 

           25                      MS. GATELLI: And Mr. Courtright


 

 

                                                                      88

 

 

            1              borrowed it, to.

 

            2                      MS. FRANUS: And you should not have

 

            3              either.  I agree completely.  None of you

 

            4              should have, and I don't think you should

 

            5              have ever been elected.

 

            6                      MS. GATELLI: The federal government

 

            7              shouldn't borrow it either, I guess.

 

            8                      MS. FRANUS:  No, we are talking

 

            9              about the city where I live.  We --

 

           10                      MS. GATELLI: Thank you, Mrs. Franus.

 

           11                      MS. FRANUS: But Mr. Dave Gervasi

 

           12              spoke for a long time after --

 

           13                      MS. GATELLI: Thank you.

 

           14                      MS. FRANUS: And this woman Phyllis

 

           15              talked after, but there is another example,

 

           16              of the way you ware.  Every time there's a

 

           17              ruckus you say, you're done now, but

 

           18              everybody else can speak as long as they

 

           19              want.  That's just an example of your

 

           20              rudeness to people.  That's just the Judy is

 

           21              back.  The sugar and lightness is gone.

 

           22              Thank God the real Judy Gatelli is shining

 

           23              through again.  This is what the people need

 

           24              to see before they go to vote so they will

 

           25              not vote for you.


 

 

                                                                      89

 

 

            1                      MS. GATELLI: They know who you are

 

            2              working for, Mrs. Franus.

 

            3                      MS. FRANUS: I'm not working for

 

            4              anyone but myself and my tax bill?  What?

 

            5                      MS. GATELLI: They know that you are

 

            6              told to come here and do this.  Thank you

 

            7              very much.

 

            8                      MS. FRANUS: Nobody makes me do

 

            9              anything, Mrs. Gatelli.

 

           10                      MS. GATELLI:  Thank you very much.

 

           11              Mr. Ancherani, it's your turn.

 

           12                      MS. FRANUS:  Thank you very much.

 

           13                      MS. GARVEY: I'm sorry to interrupt,

 

           14              but if we can please be considerate of the

 

           15              court reporter that's here trying to take

 

           16              the minutes so she can't keep up.

 

           17                      MR. ANCHERANI: Good evening.  Nelson

 

           18              Ancherani, First Amendment rights.  Last

 

           19              week Ms. Fanucci made your statement and I

 

           20              have to admit my head is still spinning.  I

 

           21              had to get council minutes just to see what

 

           22              I missed during her remarks.  I had intended

 

           23              to rebut her statements line by line, but it

 

           24              had me confused.  I figured I would pick out

 

           25              what I thought she was talking about.  She


 

 

                                                                      90

 

 

            1              said something about we are not going to be

 

            2              okay, that we should be running for our

 

            3              lives.  She said that twice.  I think she

 

            4              was trying to say that we, the police and

 

            5              fire, are using scare tactics and it is like

 

            6              it was four years ago during the election

 

            7              year.  Crime did increase in four years, it

 

            8              got worse.  It's reality.  Who is trying to

 

            9              scare who?  We don't live in the land of

 

           10              make believe, we live in Scranton, the city

 

           11              with approximately $300 million long-term

 

           12              debt.

 

           13                      Evidently, Mrs. Fanucci was not

 

           14              listening when Mr. Gervasi read from

 

           15              numerous slime's articles where our mayor

 

           16              said he was going to reduce the fire

 

           17              department personnel and close two fire

 

           18              houses or engine companies and build

 

           19              superstations.  The excerpts are from the

 

           20              last eight years.  How are they scare

 

           21              tactics now?  They are reality.  People

 

           22              should be concerned.  Close the firehouse in

 

           23              your neighborhood and it will increase the

 

           24              time it takes for fire apparatus to get to a

 

           25              fire in that neighborhood.  It will also


 

 

                                                                      91

 

 

            1              drive your fire insurance up.

 

            2                      There is a reason there is a

 

            3              question on your fire insurance policy

 

            4              asking how far away your home is from a fire

 

            5              hydrant or fire station.  Again, that is not

 

            6              scare tactics that is reality.  Reality.

 

            7              And after a certain day in May I believe you

 

            8              will see for yourselves.

 

            9                      And should I look into the camera

 

           10              when I say that like Mrs. Fanucci does it's

 

           11              not scare tactics it's reality.  As for the

 

           12              rest of what Ms. Fanucci said I'm really

 

           13              dizzy from trying to understand it.

 

           14                      MS. FANUCCI:  It's okay.  You'll

 

           15              recover.

 

           16                      MS. ANCHERANI: We used to have a

 

           17              riddler on the police force, but I believe

 

           18              the riddler was transferred to council.  I

 

           19              will pick what I thought she was referring

 

           20              to and talk about that.  As for her many

 

           21              figures on a health care copays, they are

 

           22              all lower than what we are paying now.  A

 

           23              family plan is up to $110 from $34 a pay.  A

 

           24              300 percent increase.

 

           25                      MS. FANUCCI:  I gave a weekly.  I


 

 

                                                                      92

 

 

            1              gave a weekly.

 

            2                      MR. ANCHERANI: Single is up to 31

 

            3              from $8 a pay -- it still doesn't match it,

 

            4              from $8 a pay.  A 400 percent increase in

 

            5              husband and wife is up to 44 from $4.50 a

 

            6              pay, an $1,100 increase -- I'm sorry,

 

            7              1,100 percent increase.  She showed me a

 

            8              paper with figures on it, but they did not

 

            9              match what we are paying.  I don't know

 

           10              where you got those figures from since we,

 

           11              the police union, have been trying to get

 

           12              them from the city since 2003.  It appears

 

           13              the city just grabbed figures out of the

 

           14              air, but they are no good since the Health

 

           15              Care Committee hasn't met before the city

 

           16              came up with their figures.

 

           17                      With the high figures the city is

 

           18              using, it only convinces me that the city is

 

           19              trying to get the active workers to pay the

 

           20              retired person's health care which is the

 

           21              city's responsibility.  You have to admit,

 

           22              she has a way of distracting us away from

 

           23              the issues like how are we going to make up

 

           24              that 5.5 million plugged into our 2009

 

           25              budget from the Single Tax Office.  Will our


 

 

                                                                      93

 

 

            1              taxes be raised 25 percent by Ms. Fanucci,

 

            2              Mrs. Gatelli and Mr. McGoff?  What about the

 

            3              missing two million from the Single Tax

 

            4              Office?  Why were 23 accounts merged into a

 

            5              single account?  Isn't that breaking a state

 

            6              law and what is the being done about it?  Is

 

            7              the city asking for a formal investigation

 

            8              into the missing money and why state law has

 

            9              been violated with the combining of the

 

           10              accounts.

 

           11                      Has the district attorney been asked

 

           12              to investigate?  Has the Attorney General

 

           13              been asked to investigate since state law

 

           14              has been violated?  Where is the fiduciary

 

           15              responsibility of these parties when it

 

           16              comes down to protecting the city taxpayers

 

           17              who have been subjected to a 250 percent tax

 

           18              increase which we still continue to pay all

 

           19              of the while 12.2 million was hidden in this

 

           20              account.  Taxpayers deserve answers.  But,

 

           21              no, they demand answers.  Thank you.

 

           22                      MS. GATELLI: Anyone else?  Mrs.

 

           23              Fanucci?

 

           24                      MS. FANUCCI:  Yes.  Obviously, I'm

 

           25              going to take off where Mr. Ancherani left


 

 

                                                                      94

 

 

            1              off for us and, no, it's not a gotcha.  It

 

            2              is the facts and I am presenting exactly

 

            3              what I received as facts and that is what

 

            4              I'm going to do.

 

            5                      So, the fact is that, yes, we did

 

            6              not settle our contracts, but the unions did

 

            7              get to use their existing contracts for

 

            8              seven years while we were in litigation.

 

            9              The arbitration they got to use included

 

           10              some of these benefits, and I'm going to

 

           11              read some of these:

 

           12                      The actual overtime costs, and I'm

 

           13              going to do this again for 2007, was

 

           14              $621,649.38.  Overtime in 2008, $712,350.33.

 

           15              I'll write this down for you.  Te contracts

 

           16              that these -- that have been complaining

 

           17              about were good contracts.  That's why they

 

           18              stuck around.  They didn't fight because

 

           19              they were a bad contract, and I will look in

 

           20              the camera any time I want to look into the

 

           21              camera because I'm speaking to everyone out

 

           22              there not just the people in this room.

 

           23              This is about the taxpayers and it's their

 

           24              money.  It's their money, not just the ten

 

           25              people who come here, so I will speak to


 

 

                                                                      95

 

 

            1              them all of the time.

 

            2                      The salary plus overtime plus

 

            3              longevity, longevity pay is 2 percent every

 

            4              two years you get 2 percent of your salary

 

            5              added on.

 

            6                      MR. GERVASI: One.

 

            7                      MS. FANUCCI:  That happens -- it's 1

 

            8              percent every year, but you don't get it

 

            9              until it's 2 percent which is the two years.

 

           10                      MS. GERVASI:  One percent every two

 

           11              years.

 

           12                      MS. FANUCCI: One percent every two

 

           13              years.

 

           14                      MR. GERVASI: Please.

 

           15                      MS. GATELLI:  Excuse me.

 

           16                      MS. FANUCCI: Okay, let's go into the

 

           17              figures because they really want to -- so

 

           18              let's do this.  Let's go, okay.  If you're a

 

           19              deputy chief and you work for the fire

 

           20              department your base salary might be

 

           21              $42,498.83.  With your overtime pay, with an

 

           22              average now, this is just an average, you

 

           23              are making an extra $1,850.68 as an average

 

           24              overtime pay.  Your average longevity for

 

           25              your deputy chief is $4,430.45.  If we take


 

 

                                                                      96

 

 

            1              together our base wage, well, no, let's not

 

            2              even talk about base wage, let's just do

 

            3              overtime and longevity, you are getting

 

            4              $6,236.13 over your base pay.  There is only

 

            5              one deputy chief.

 

            6                      So let's go to an assistant chief,

 

            7              assistant chief with an average overtime pay

 

            8              and an average longevity pay they are making

 

            9              $8,000 -- 8,363.56, that's with overtime and

 

           10              longevity.  There are four of them.

 

           11                      Fire inspectors, there are two of

 

           12              them.  Their average overtime pay $1,244.10,

 

           13              let's add that with their longevity

 

           14              $4,209.26 for an average of $5,453.36.

 

           15                      So, my theory is you are at home,

 

           16              yes, they did not get a cost of living

 

           17              increase.  It's terrible.  It's awful, but

 

           18              would you consider an extra $5,000 or $4,000

 

           19              or $6,000 in your pay extra money?

 

           20              Longevity is just for the amount of time

 

           21              that you have been here.  There is no other

 

           22              reason for it.  Overtime I could see.  You

 

           23              work overtime, but also remember in these

 

           24              contracts when you work overtime because of

 

           25              the contracts we can't as a city cut costs


 

 

                                                                      97

 

 

            1              like you could in a business.  Why?  Because

 

            2              in the contracts you have to pay time and a

 

            3              half or holiday time for every overtime.

 

            4                      Now, in an outside business you can

 

            5              say, "et's have a part-timer come in.  Let's

 

            6              have them come in, it won't cost us health

 

            7              care insurance and it also won't cost us

 

            8              quite as much money because we won't have to

 

            9              pay time and a half."

 

           10                      You can't do that here.  This is why

 

           11              our overtime is $700,000 and that is why --

 

           12                      MR. GERVASI: It's $700,000 because

 

           13              they got rid of people.

 

           14                      MS. GATELLI: Mr. Gervasi.

 

           15                      MS. FANUCCI: Well, you're --

 

           16                      MS. GATELLI: Mr. Gervasi --

 

           17                      MR. GERVASI:  I'm not going to sit

 

           18              here, Mrs. Gatelli, and listen to her lie

 

           19              and Lisa Moran is --

 

           20                      MS. GATELLI: Mr. Gervasi, you are

 

           21              out of the order.

 

           22                      MR. GERVASI: The overtime is

 

           23              $700,000 because --

 

           24                      MS. GATELLI: Please -

 

           25                      MR. GERVASI: -- because they laid


 

 

                                                                      98

 

 

            1              off --

 

            2                      MS. GATELLI: Please, Mr. Gervasi.

 

            3                      MR. GERVASI: -- they laid off 50

 

            4              firefighters.

 

            5                      MS. FANUCCI: This is what they want,

 

            6              the fear tactics.

 

            7                      MS. GATELLI: Mr. Gervasi, please.

 

            8                      MS. FANUCCI: This is in the

 

            9              contract, this is not made up.  It certainly

 

           10              isn't something I pulled out of my hat -- -

 

           11                      MR. GERVASI:  The state did it.

 

           12                      MS. FANUCCI: This is where ---

 

           13                      MS. GATELLI: Mr. Gervasi, please.

 

           14                      MS. FANUCCI:  This is where this was

 

           15              worth the fight on both sides, so when you

 

           16              are out there and you're feeling bad for one

 

           17              side or the other, I had said this from day

 

           18              one this fight was not ending until we got

 

           19              at the end of the rope which was in Court.

 

           20              Why?  There was two much on both sides.  Am

 

           21              I saying it's wrong?  No.  Am I saying you

 

           22              don't deserve it?  No.  But I'm saying it

 

           23              was going to be a fight and it was going to

 

           24              be a dog fight and whether or not you feel

 

           25              bad and you think the administration is


 

 

                                                                      99

 

 

            1              right or you think the firefighters are

 

            2              right this was not ending until we got to

 

            3              the end of the rope.  Now we are there.  Now

 

            4              there is a contract, right, a Court-ordered

 

            5              contact.  You don't see the litigation

 

            6              stopping.  You don't see the fighting

 

            7              stopping.  You didn't see anybody saying,

 

            8              you know what, now we are making more money

 

            9              and plus we still are doing okay because,

 

           10              you, know when you look at the salaries they

 

           11              are making more money now.  You don't see

 

           12              anybody stopping, it's still in Court.

 

           13                      MR. GERVASI: Because the city is in

 

           14              contempt.

 

           15                      MS. FANUCCI:  It is still in court.

 

           16                      MR. GERVASI:  Because the city is in

 

           17              contempt.

 

           18                      MS. GATELLI: Mr. Gervasi.

 

           19                      MS. FANUCCI: And it will not stop

 

           20              until it's at the last level.  All I am

 

           21              saying is if you think that this is one side

 

           22              or another you are absolutely wrong.  These

 

           23              are huge figures.  This is a lot of money

 

           24              and that is why this fight will continue.

 

           25              That's it.  Like it or not.


 

 

                                                                     100

 

 

            1                      Week after week I hear everybody

 

            2              blaming the health care, oh, now it's the

 

            3              consultant, right?  We have the wrong

 

            4              consultant, this is the money we were saving

 

            5              whatever.  Health care has gone up so much

 

            6              for every person at home.  Every single

 

            7              person knows that they are working for their

 

            8              health care.  That's it.  If they could keep

 

            9              their family covered they are happy.  So if

 

           10              you honestly believe that that -- in a big

 

           11              city that we are going to honestly think

 

           12              that this health care should be down to $5

 

           13              or $11 is too much to pay a pay people would

 

           14              be thrilled at home to pay $11 a pay to have

 

           15              health care.  Thrilled to death.  So whether

 

           16              you like it or not, you can come up here and

 

           17              you can bash me all you want, you can yell,

 

           18              you can say my fingers aren't good, whatever

 

           19              you want to do, because you know you are

 

           20              going to do it because you have to do it.

 

           21              You have been doing it for eight years.  You

 

           22              have to keep to doing it.  It's okay.

 

           23                      MR. GERVASI:  Maybe --

 

           24                      MS. FANUCCI: We understand why.  We

 

           25              understand why.  When you come up they're


 

 

                                                                     101

 

 

            1              facts, when everybody comes up they're

 

            2              wrong.

 

            3                      MR. GERVASI: You're wrong.

 

            4                      MS. FANUCCI: So I'm going to make a

 

            5              motion today that we get Stu Renda in here

 

            6              to come in, sit down with all of the

 

            7              figures, show us exactly what's been going

 

            8              on since day one.  I want to know what

 

            9              people make, overtime, what they're doing,

 

           10              how much health care is and I want it all

 

           11              displayed here, and I don't care when it

 

           12              happens, I don't care if it's in the next

 

           13              two weeks or the next four weeks, whenever

 

           14              we could do it.  I'd like to have a Power

 

           15              Point presentation if he can put it together

 

           16              so people at home can watch it on TV and

 

           17              then we'll put an end to this he said, she

 

           18              said, they said, whatever because it is out

 

           19              of control.

 

           20                      And when you have people come up

 

           21              here like we have tonight and, Fay, I'm not

 

           22              sure you are going to be here next week

 

           23              after I talk about you, it was obviously

 

           24              political.  She went in a whole speech about

 

           25              somebody who are ran, who ran with them,


 

 

                                                                     102

 

 

            1              when they decided to change their mind and

 

            2              how your loyalty should be.  It's not about

 

            3              loyalty, it's about belief systems and it's

 

            4              about working together and whether you like

 

            5              it or not she could have ran with me, she

 

            6              could have ran with Bill, but at the end of

 

            7              it all you need to work with whoever is here

 

            8              to get what's needed to be done for the

 

            9              people who are out there.  Saying no all of

 

           10              the time does not help one person, not one

 

           11              person in this city.  Saying no, no, no, no,

 

           12              no all it is is a standstill, so you are

 

           13              wrong by believing that your council should

 

           14              be sitting hear saying no to everything

 

           15              because the only people who are going to

 

           16              suffer are your taxpayers.  You need to sit

 

           17              down and battle it out and decide a good

 

           18              reason and good way to proceed and a good

 

           19              cure and that's what it's about.

 

           20                      So when you are up here every week

 

           21              saying, "You should stop this, you should

 

           22              stop that," no.  No.  You shouldn't stop

 

           23              anything.  You should try to work it out and

 

           24              find a way to help the people out there.  I

 

           25              can't imagine that after all of this time


 

 

                                                                     103

 

 

            1              that we are still going to talk about who

 

            2              ran with who and who did what and who said

 

            3              what.  People are out there, they are

 

            4              suffering.  They need jobs.  Whether you

 

            5              like the type of jobs they have we need

 

            6              them.  If it's a coffee shop, if it's a

 

            7              flower shop, we need every job in this city

 

            8              so that people can go and work, so they can

 

            9              take care of their families.  Look around

 

           10              this country.  People cannot support their

 

           11              families.  For some reason you think we are

 

           12              any different than anyone else.  The

 

           13              difference is we are actually working and we

 

           14              have people who are going to work.  That's

 

           15              the difference.  Maybe our -- you know, we

 

           16              are not where we need to be, I agree we will

 

           17              never be where we need to be, but at least

 

           18              we are trying and we are working hard and

 

           19              making jobs.  Whether they are not high

 

           20              enough for you, I agree.  I would love to

 

           21              get everybody -- I would love everybody in

 

           22              the city to get a $100,000 job a year I wish

 

           23              we could, but reality is that is not the way

 

           24              life is.  People cannot all -- aren't

 

           25              qualified for $100,000 a year job.  I


 

 

                                                                     104

 

 

            1              certainly am not.  People aren't.  So you

 

            2              take a job at the level you are qualified

 

            3              for.  The thing is we need to make sure they

 

            4              are here.

 

            5                      You can come up and bash me every

 

            6              week, you know, on the website which I love

 

            7              that actually people come up and defend this

 

            8              website that does nothing but say how bad we

 

            9              are anonymously, you know, hiding behind

 

           10              their little fake names and saying, you

 

           11              know, this one or that one last week they

 

           12              were -- from what I've heard because I won't

 

           13              go on anymore, but they bashed my family for

 

           14              being strong women.  Bashed my family.  The

 

           15              Skatinos are bad people.  Their women should

 

           16              take their meatballs and go home was a quote

 

           17              on this website that all of the union

 

           18              leaders get up and talk about like it's a

 

           19              good thing.  Every one of you on this

 

           20              website talking about my family.

 

           21                      MR. GERVASI:  I never talk about

 

           22              your family.

 

           23                      MS. FANUCCI: You are the only --

 

           24              Nancy did.  Ancherani quotes it --

 

           25                      MR. GERVASI: You --


 

 

                                                                     105

 

 

            1                      MS. FANUCCI: Just because you don't

 

            2              talk about it --

 

            3                      MR. GERVASI: Please stop talking for

 

            4              just a minute.

 

            5                      MS. FANUCCI: Kiss them in the back

 

            6              room.  Come on, enough is enough.  I'll play

 

            7              your game, but on this website they said you

 

            8              all of these things about my family who have

 

            9              been in small business here their whole

 

           10              entire lives, their whole entire lives.

 

           11              Entrepreneurs.  Every one of them had

 

           12              businesses in this city and they love this

 

           13              city and they love the people here and

 

           14              that's why I have been doing what I have

 

           15              been doing.  That's why I put up with all of

 

           16              this week after week.  They said we should

 

           17              take our meatballs and go home.  You know

 

           18              why they said that because they don't have a

 

           19              set of their own.  They don't.  They hide

 

           20              behind their fake names and they go on their

 

           21              website and they talk to each other back and

 

           22              forth and they talk to themselves and they

 

           23              do nothing about spawn hate and constantly,

 

           24              constantly say negative things about people

 

           25              in this city.  Everyone.  There isn't anyone


 

 

                                                                     106

 

 

            1              they spare, so it's not like they get along,

 

            2              they only get along with each other.

 

            3                      I am not -- yes.  You, too.  Yes.

 

            4              You, too.  You have been on there and you

 

            5              have talked about it, also so don't look

 

            6              confused.  You have been there also, you

 

            7              have talked about it on here putting up with

 

            8              the website and thinking it's a good thing.

 

            9                      MS. HUMPHRIES: No, I don't know how

 

           10              to you use the website.

 

           11                      MS. FANUCCI: I'm not talking about

 

           12              you, Phyllis.  So this is what is going to

 

           13              happen for the next few weeks.  This is your

 

           14              wonderful council in session, but I am

 

           15              telling you right now I'm not going to stop

 

           16              saying what I need to say.  I am very happy

 

           17              with what I'm saying.  I'm telling you facts

 

           18              that aren't really pretty facts sometimes

 

           19              and when you are sitting home a lot of these

 

           20              facts aren't going to make you feel real

 

           21              comfortable because you don't have these

 

           22              options.  You don't have this.  You don't

 

           23              have this -- you don't have longevity pay.

 

           24              You don't get an extra $4,000 in your

 

           25              paycheck just for being there.  I certainly


 

 

                                                                     107

 

 

            1              don't either.  So I understand that this is

 

            2              going to be a tough ride, and I'm sorry that

 

            3              it has to be this way, but it is what it is.

 

            4              It's time for all of the truth to come out

 

            5              not just some of it.  Thank you.

 

            6                      MR. MINORA: Excuse me.  Excuse me,

 

            7              Mrs. Fanucci, you started to make a motion

 

            8              about Mr. Renda.

 

            9                      MS. FANUCCI:  I'm sorry.  Yes.  That

 

           10              Mr. Renda comes in and then he does a

 

           11              presentation on what the salaries are, what

 

           12              the health care cost is, what it was, and

 

           13              what it is now and how much we are paying a

 

           14              city per person and how much the people are

 

           15              contributing.

 

           16                      MS. GATELLI: I'll second that

 

           17              motion.

 

           18                      MS. FANUCCI: Thank you.

 

           19                      MS. GATELLI: On the question?

 

           20                      MR. COURTRIGHT: On the question, I

 

           21              think Mr. Renda coming in, just Mr. Renda,

 

           22              isn't going to solve anything.  I think if

 

           23              Mr. Renda is going to come in you are going

 

           24              to have three unions and their

 

           25              representatives --


 

 

                                                                     108

 

 

            1                      MS. FANUCCI: Why?  They are tax --

 

            2              the had time to speak on --

 

            3                      MR. COURTRIGHT: It's my turn to talk

 

            4              now.

 

            5                      MS. FANUCCI: Okay.  Go ahead.

 

            6                      MR. COURTRIGHT: Because he is going

 

            7              to come in and say anything, and then they

 

            8              are going the next week and say he is wrong,

 

            9              if we are going to have them in let's have

 

           10              all sides in, let them do their

 

           11              presentation, give them whatever minutes

 

           12              they need.  Give Mr. Renda twenty minutes,

 

           13              allow the union twenty minutes if they are

 

           14              going to do a power point, let them do a

 

           15              power point, because Mr. Renda is going to

 

           16              come in and say something and we all know

 

           17              what he says they are going to dispute.

 

           18                      MS. FANUCCI: Well, facts are facts

 

           19              and figures are in the budget.  I mean,

 

           20              logically --

 

           21                      MR. COURTRIGHT:  Well, that's his

 

           22              interpretation, and, no, I've heard facts

 

           23              and their interpretation, so let's be fair.

 

           24                      MS. FANUCCI: All right.  Well, wait,

 

           25              let me ask you this, Bill, we weren't fair


 

 

                                                                     109

 

 

            1              when we had them come in the last two times

 

            2              by themselves.  They came in, we had the

 

            3              union representative come in and speak and

 

            4              give a whole presentation and we didn't have

 

            5              Stu here.

 

            6                      MS. GATELLI:  Twice he came.

 

            7                      MS. FANUCCI:  Twice he came.  Twice.

 

            8                      MR. COURTRIGHT: I just think it's

 

            9              not fair.

 

           10                      MS. FANUCCI: So why is that any

 

           11              different?  Why is this any different?  I'm

 

           12              looking for figures.  I'm looking for facts,

 

           13              what is paid out.  We are not talking about

 

           14              a he said, she said.  They know what they

 

           15              pay.  So we had them in here twice.  We had

 

           16              them in here twice, let's have Stu and maybe

 

           17              he can come twice and then we'll have the

 

           18              union back again.

 

           19                      MR. COURTRIGHT: I just don't think

 

           20              it's going to accomplish anything if we have

 

           21              just the one side here and that's my

 

           22              opinion.

 

           23                      MS. FANUCCI:  Well, we have already

 

           24              done that so now --

 

           25                      MR. COURTRIGHT: Okay.  Have the


 

 

                                                                     110

 

 

            1              vote.

 

            2                      MS. FANUCCI: Okay.

 

            3                      MS. GATELLI: All in favor?

 

            4                      MS. FANUCCI: Aye.

 

            5                      MS. GATELLI: Aye.  Opposed?

 

            6                      MR. COURTRIGHT: No.  I don't know

 

            7              where to start here.  I had brought up a few

 

            8              weeks back that I had several complaints

 

            9              about Washburn Street.  I think I mentioned

 

           10              before that last year we had several roads

 

           11              paved because the utilities tore them up and

 

           12              they are obligated to pave the entire road

 

           13              if they tear up a certain percentage and

 

           14              they paved Washburn Street, the full length

 

           15              of it, it was coming apart in the center

 

           16              where they seamed it, so I spoke to the

 

           17              pave -- I think that's his title, right, the

 

           18              pave cut inspector and they've tarred the

 

           19              entire length of Washburn Street in the

 

           20              center and I hope that rectifies it and so

 

           21              I'm happy that something got done here.

 

           22                      I was scanning through the channels

 

           23              on Easter Sunday when I got home from my

 

           24              mom's house and the school board meeting was

 

           25              on and somebody asked Mr. Gilbride, who is


 

 

                                                                     111

 

 

            1              the president of the school board, asked him

 

            2              a question about the audit that was done

 

            3              and, okay, so Mr. Jackowitz is saying it was

 

            4              him, if I'm incorrect then you can correct

 

            5              me, I believe he asked him if when

 

            6              Mr. Gilbride gave his authorization to pay

 

            7              for this audit he didn't believe it was a

 

            8              forensic audit and Mr. Gilbride said that he

 

            9              paid for a forensic audit.  So that prompted

 

           10              me to call Mr. Renda, and I called Mr. Renda

 

           11              and he called me back and I asked Mr. Renda

 

           12              the question -- that question.  I said,

 

           13              "When you signed off or whatever you had to

 

           14              do to pay for this audit, did you believe it

 

           15              was a forensic audit?"

 

           16                      And he said, "Yes.  That's what the

 

           17              city thought they were paying for was a

 

           18              forensic audit."

 

           19                      I said, "Well, when did you find out

 

           20              it wasn't a forensic audit?"

 

           21                      And he said the day they went down

 

           22              to the meeting at the solicitor's office

 

           23              with Mr. McGovern, Mr. McGoff and

 

           24              Mrs. Garvey he had gone down there.

 

           25                      And I said, "Well, you know, the


 

 

                                                                     112

 

 

            1              papers quotes that the tax office as saying

 

            2              it wasn't a forensic audit, it was merely a

 

            3              ringing catch phrase."

 

            4                      And I told Mr. Renda that I -- I

 

            5              was-- and I haven't talked to the county so

 

            6              I can't speak for the county, I assume we

 

            7              spoke -- or listened to the school district

 

            8              and spoke to the city and, you know, I said

 

            9              I don't think it's fair that we paid for

 

           10              something and, you know, say we bought a

 

           11              vehicle and we paid for the options on that

 

           12              vehicle and we paid the price for the

 

           13              options and we didn't get them, so I don't

 

           14              know that it's fair that we pay for

 

           15              something we didn't get, and I don't believe

 

           16              that she should continue to pay for it.

 

           17                      So, I'll try to contact

 

           18              Mr. Gilbride, I only saw him on TV and I'll

 

           19              try to contact Mr. Renda to see are we

 

           20              continuing to pay because the newspaper said

 

           21              that I believe it's $134,000 and counting,

 

           22              so evidently we are paying more.  But, if

 

           23              both of those gentleman signed off on paying

 

           24              for a forensic audit then we should have

 

           25              gotten a forensic audit and, obviously, we


 

 

                                                                     113

 

 

            1              didn't.

 

            2                      Moving on, I stopped at Keyser

 

            3              Valley Community Center last week, they were

 

            4              having a meeting, and something was brought

 

            5              to my attention.  I saw Amil left, but maybe

 

            6              Kay can ask him for me, they are telling me

 

            7              something that I wasn't aware of that if you

 

            8              hold a function where you need a police

 

            9              officer at your function like a dance or

 

           10              something to that affect, that you can pay

 

           11              the city for the police officer, which we

 

           12              always have, but they are saying there is an

 

           13              administrative fee attached to it now that I

 

           14              have no knowledge of an administrative fee,

 

           15              and the question that I wanted to ask

 

           16              Mr. Minora because it was asked of me and I

 

           17              don't know the answer to this is if they

 

           18              attached an administrative fee to it -- to

 

           19              the cost of the officer did legislation or

 

           20              should have legislation gone through city

 

           21              council if you are attaching a fee to

 

           22              something.  I'm guessing maybe it should

 

           23              have, I don't know, so maybe we can ask

 

           24              Mr. Minora that.  And then also, Kay, if you

 

           25              could do me a favor and I guess it would be


 

 

                                                                     114

 

 

            1              to Dave Elliott ask him if there, in fact,

 

            2              an administrative fee because that was the

 

            3              first I heard about it was that night.  I

 

            4              was not aware of that, so if there isn't one

 

            5              then we don't need the answer from

 

            6              Mr. Minora I guess, but if there is one I

 

            7              certainly would like to have that answer.

 

            8                      So much went on here tonight I can't

 

            9              remember everything, but I know at some

 

           10              point in time somebody talked about the

 

           11              University of Scranton, and I'd like to say

 

           12              this, I asked this for all of the years I

 

           13              have been there and I don't think it will

 

           14              ever happened, but I'll ask it again that

 

           15              the University of Scranton gives some kind

 

           16              of a break, either free tuition or a break

 

           17              on the tuition to the people that live in

 

           18              this city, to the people that live in the

 

           19              city and families that have been paying the

 

           20              taxes all these years, give them some kind

 

           21              of a break.  I really think that that would

 

           22              go a long way with the citizens of this

 

           23              city.  I think it's gotten to the point

 

           24              where the price is so high a lot of people

 

           25              in this city can't afford to go there, so


 

 

                                                                     115

 

 

            1              some kind of break, I would think, if your

 

            2              family has been a resident here for "X"

 

            3              amount of years, I think it's warranted.  I

 

            4              know I worked at Trane Corporation for years

 

            5              and when they closed down one of my buddies

 

            6              moved to Carolina because I believe if you

 

            7              were a residents there for a year you went

 

            8              to their state school for free, so I'd like

 

            9              to see the University do something,

 

           10              something to help out the people and it's

 

           11              not to benefit my children, they will be

 

           12              long gone from college by then, but

 

           13              everybody else that lives here and suffers

 

           14              throughout hard times that we have had here.

 

           15                      And the zoo, I have to agree with

 

           16              Mr. Ellman.  I think, yeah, you keep going

 

           17              back to a zoo and it's something you go back

 

           18              to time and time again.  I don't think the

 

           19              city can afford a zoo.  I would like to see

 

           20              maybe the county get involved and maybe

 

           21              partner with the city or -- the county has a

 

           22              lot more resources than the city does and

 

           23              maybe partner with the city and let's have a

 

           24              zoo up there because I think it is something

 

           25              that people would come here to see and the


 

 

                                                                     116

 

 

            1              main reason I say the county also is because

 

            2              people enjoy whether it's the Genesis

 

            3              Wildlife or whatever was there before from

 

            4              the entire county, not just the city, but we

 

            5              are stuck paying a lot of the bills that

 

            6              people from outside of the city enjoy, so

 

            7              maybe the county would entertain something

 

            8              like that and take a look and see if they

 

            9              can help us out if it's feasible.  If they

 

           10              even have the money, I don't know.

 

           11                      And one last thing somebody

 

           12              mentioned about, you know, firefighters just

 

           13              sitting at the firehouse, well, I got to be

 

           14              honest with you, I hope that every single

 

           15              day of every year the firefighters are doing

 

           16              nothing but sitting at the firehouse because

 

           17              then that means somebody's house isn't on

 

           18              fire and to me that's a good thing, and I'll

 

           19              end it with that.  Thank you.

 

           20                      MS. GATELLI: Thank you,

 

           21              Mr. Courtright.  Well, we talked about

 

           22              having people come here and I read in an

 

           23              e-mail this week that we got from the tax

 

           24              office that they would be willing to come

 

           25              here and explain some more of the details of


 

 

                                                                     117

 

 

            1              the tax report I'll call it since it really

 

            2              wasn't an audit, so I would like to ask Kay

 

            3              to have them come here possibly next week to

 

            4              meet with council.

 

            5                      MS. GARVEY: Any time?

 

            6                      MS. GATELLI:  I'd say probably 5:30

 

            7              so we will have adequate time to ask any of

 

            8              the questions that we can come up with for

 

            9              them when they get here.

 

           10                      I met yesterday with Representative

 

           11              Ken Smith and the residents of Meadow

 

           12              Avenue.  If you haven't realized for the

 

           13              past 12 years they are been trying to get

 

           14              sound barriers in this area of Harmond field

 

           15              for Route 81.  Over that 12-year period many

 

           16              people have promised that we would get sound

 

           17              barriers and for some reason PennDOT always

 

           18              redirected the money to a different project.

 

           19              If you should go to the Meadow Avenue area

 

           20              and sit on anyone's porch there you would

 

           21              hear the loud tractor trailers going by and

 

           22              the great amount of traffic that has

 

           23              increased on Route 81 over the years and the

 

           24              smell of diesel fuel is rather obnoxious, so

 

           25              Representative Smith has been working on


 

 

                                                                     118

 

 

            1              that project and he came to one of the homes

 

            2              there and we were informed that Congressman

 

            3              Kanjorski would like to do a project in the

 

            4              area and was very interested in the sound

 

            5              barriers using some of the stimulus money

 

            6              for Pennsylvania, so I would like to make a

 

            7              motion that we send a letter to

 

            8              Representative Smith and to Congressman

 

            9              Kanjorski supporting the project of sound

 

           10              barriers for the Meadow Avenue area.

 

           11                      MS. FANUCCI: I second that.

 

           12                      MS. GATELLI:  On the question?  All

 

           13              in favor?  Aye.

 

           14                      MR. COURTRIGHT: Aye.

 

           15                      MS. FANUCCI: Aye.

 

           16                      MS. GATELLI:  Thank you.  I got

 

           17              another e-mail from a gentleman who has a

 

           18              Boy Scout Troop, I'm probably going to say

 

           19              the wrong Boy Scout Troop, but I think it's

 

           20              Hickory Street, and he said that as much as

 

           21              people come here and say that there is a

 

           22              bridge to nowhere up at Nay Aug, that the

 

           23              bridge does go somewhere.  It goes to the

 

           24              other side and on the other side is where

 

           25              the Boy Scout Troop has cleared it out and


 

 

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            1              they spend evenings there in their tents and

 

            2              do some of their projects, so the Boy Scouts

 

            3              and the Boy Scout leader are very thrilled

 

            4              about the bridge and they are going to be a

 

            5              lot more work up there this summer, so he

 

            6              wanted to me to report that.

 

            7                      I'd like to apologize for my

 

            8              behavior this evening, but Mrs. Franus

 

            9              certainly knows how to push my buttons and I

 

           10              was told that the last few weeks before the

 

           11              election she is going to come here and push

 

           12              my buttons and she did, and I let her so I

 

           13              will try to control myself, but for those of

 

           14              you at home it is very difficult when you

 

           15              are sitting here and you have to listen to

 

           16              things that aren't true especially when it

 

           17              had involved other family members.

 

           18                      Now, the website certainly had a gun

 

           19              on it and it certainly had a head blowing

 

           20              off.  You can go back in the archives and

 

           21              read the newspaper and find out what it was

 

           22              all about.  The district attorney was

 

           23              notified.  I was very frightened, yes, I

 

           24              will admit, something like that had never

 

           25              happened to me and it was bullying that's


 

 

                                                                     120

 

 

            1              all it was and I didn't realize it at the

 

            2              time and I was very scared.  I had a

 

            3              windshield broken, I had flattened tires,

 

            4              sometimes I was followed.  I was talked

 

            5              about on the website, called all kinds of

 

            6              vulgar names.  My children, my grandson who

 

            7              is six years old was on there, it is

 

            8              despicable, and for people to come up here

 

            9              and say that's a wonderful thing you should

 

           10              be ashamed of yourselves every one of you.

 

           11              Police officers come up here that are

 

           12              supposed to be protecting me and you and

 

           13              everyone else and they defend this website

 

           14              where people are desecrated.  Their lives

 

           15              are desecrated behind names of people that

 

           16              are anonymous.  Well, aren't you brave.  All

 

           17              of you that write on there you are very

 

           18              brave.  You cowards.  Come here and say it.

 

           19              I have never done that in my life.  I say

 

           20              what I think to your face and any of you

 

           21              that know me know that.  I will tell you

 

           22              what I think to your face.  I don't have to

 

           23              go on a computer and call you a whore and

 

           24              call your daughters -- that your daughters

 

           25              have oral sex with people, that's


 

 

                                                                     121

 

 

            1              disgusting.

 

            2                      So, come up here and keep saying how

 

            3              wonderful it is and keep kissing everyone

 

            4              back there when they come here and putting

 

            5              your little notes around giving them to

 

            6              people to tell them what to say when they

 

            7              get up here.

 

            8                      I have only been here three years.

 

            9              There were people here before me that could

 

           10              have done and could have changed things,

 

           11              they had the majority then and they didn't

 

           12              to it.  They borrowed money just like I did.

 

           13              They borrowed a lot of money.  How do you

 

           14              think you are going to survive in a

 

           15              community without borrowing money in this

 

           16              day and age?  We can't go bankrupt because

 

           17              they will raise the taxes out of the roof.

 

           18              They won't go up $55, they will go up $555.

 

           19              We only get 17 percent of your tax dollar.

 

           20              The rest goes to the school district and to

 

           21              the county and I don't see anybody going

 

           22              there complaining.  Why not?  Why do they

 

           23              only come here?  And why is it election

 

           24              time?  Why don't we examining all of the

 

           25              candidates running for office, and I think


 

 

                                                                     122

 

 

            1              the newspaper it would behoove them to

 

            2              inspect criminal records of the candidates

 

            3              because some of them have criminal records,

 

            4              and we can start there.

 

            5                      I sat here and I did the best job I

 

            6              could.  I tried to do what I thought was

 

            7              right for the community and for my

 

            8              neighborhoods and I have been doing that for

 

            9              all of my adult life, and I know you don't

 

           10              like to hear that, but I'm very proud of

 

           11              that.  I'm very proud that I volunteered my

 

           12              time for my community.  Can you say the same

 

           13              thing, that you have done for your community

 

           14              for 28 years for no pay at all?  I never got

 

           15              paid.  Never at all.  I'm getting paid now

 

           16              for what I do up here, it's not a lot of

 

           17              money, but it helps and I donate a lot of it

 

           18              to charity and I'm proud of that, too.

 

           19                      And I'll keep fighting for my

 

           20              neighborhood and I'll keep fighting the

 

           21              slumlords that don't pay their taxes, and

 

           22              I'll keep fighting the drug houses and the

 

           23              illegal apartment conversions and I'll keep

 

           24              doing that even if I don't win.  I will keep

 

           25              fighting for my community no matter how many


 

 

                                                                     123

 

 

            1              times you come up here and try to down me.

 

            2              I have a reputation in my community and I

 

            3              love the people here and whoever is the

 

            4              mayor here I would work with, whoever it is.

 

            5              Whoever wins the election I will sit here

 

            6              and I will work with.  I won't be a

 

            7              obstructionist and say, "Well, I wasn't on

 

            8              his ticket or I didn't help him, I'm not

 

            9              going to do whatever he wants, I'm going to

 

           10              go against him all of the time."

 

           11                      No, I'm not going to do that.

 

           12              Whoever is the mayor I will work with so the

 

           13              community can move forward, not just for my

 

           14              own agenda because my agenda will be the

 

           15              same even if I'm not here, and you can laugh

 

           16              all you want, Mrs. Krake, just keep on

 

           17              laughing.

 

           18                      MR. GERVASI: We are talking about

 

           19              something else.

 

           20                      MS. GATELLI: Because that's all you

 

           21              guys do is laugh and kibitz in the back and

 

           22              the camera doesn't see that.  They don't see

 

           23              what we have to see from up here and it is

 

           24              very, very difficult.  A very difficult job

 

           25              to be on city council to be abused and


 

 

                                                                     124

 

 

            1              harassed on a continual basis.

 

            2                      MS. FANUCCI:  Only some of us.

 

            3                      MS. GATELLI: Only some of us, you

 

            4              are right.  So Mrs. Franus can come here

 

            5              every week until election time and harass

 

            6              me, that's okay.  That's perfectly all

 

            7              right, but I'm going to keep on doing what

 

            8              I'm doing for the good of my community, and

 

            9              I have always fought for firemen to keep my

 

           10              firehouse open and I have always fought for

 

           11              police officers on the street, so if they

 

           12              tell you that I didn't they are lying about

 

           13              that, too.  Go get all of the papers and

 

           14              read them and see who fought for your

 

           15              neighborhood fire station, and I did it

 

           16              again a couple of weeks ago even though they

 

           17              come here and criticize me I voted for it

 

           18              anyhow because that's what I believe in and

 

           19              it's hard to vote for what you believe in

 

           20              when they are coming here and harassing you.

 

           21              You want to vote against them because it's

 

           22              not nice to go and do that to people.  Not

 

           23              nice at all.  Thank you.  Mrs. Garvey?

 

           24                      MS. GARVEY: FIFTH ORDER.  5-B. FOR

 

           25              INTRODUCTION - A RESOLUTION - AUTHORIZING


 

 

                                                                     125

 

 

            1              THE MAYOR AND OTHER APPROPRIATE CITY

 

            2              OFFICIALS TO EXECUTE AND ENTER INTO A

 

            3              COOPERATIVE AGREEMENT BETWEEN THE CITY OF

 

            4              SCRANTON, DEPARTMENT OF PARKS AND RECREATION

 

            5              ("ORGANIZATION") AND THE LACKAWANNA COUNTY

 

            6              DEPARTMENT OF ARTS AND CULTURE ("ARTS AND

 

            7              CULTURE") AND LACKAWANNA COUNTY CHILDREN AND

 

            8              YOUTH SERVICES ("LCCYS") IN FURTHERANCE OF

 

            9              THE MISSION OF THE ARTS ENGAGE! PROGRAM.

 

           10                      MS. GATELLI: At this time I'll

 

           11              entertain a motion that Item 5-B be

 

           12              introduced into it's committee.

 

           13                      MR. COURTRIGHT: So moved.

 

           14                      MS. FANUCCI: Second.

 

           15                      MS. GATELLI: On the question.  All

 

           16              those in favor?  Aye.

 

           17                      MR. COURTRIGHT: Aye.

 

           18                      MS. FANUCCI: Aye.

 

           19                      MS. GATELLI: Opposed?  The ayes have

 

           20              it so moved.

 

           21                      MS. GARVEY: SIXTH ORDER.  6-A.

 

           22              READING BY TITLE - FILE OF COUNCIL NO. 62,

 

           23              2009 - AN ORDINANCE - CREATING AND

 

           24              ESTABLISHING SPECIAL CITY ACCOUNT NO.

 

           25              02.229590 ENTITLED "A.R.T.S. ENGAGE!  GRANT"


 

 

                                                                     126

 

 

            1              FOR THE RECEIPT AND DISBURSEMENT OF GRANT

 

            2              FUNDS FROM LACKAWANNA COUNTY CHILDREN AND

 

            3              YOUTH SERVICES AND DEPARTMENT OF ARTS AND

 

            4              CULTURE FOR THE DEPARTMENT OF PARKS AND

 

            5              RECREATION CITY OF SCRANTON POOL MURALS

 

            6              PROGRAM.

 

            7                      MS. GATELLI: You have heard reading

 

            8              by title of Item 6-A, what is your pleasure?

 

            9                      MR. COURTRIGHT: I move that Item 6-A

 

           10              pass reading my title.

 

           11                      MS. FANUCCI: Second.

 

           12                      MS. GATELLI: On the question?  All

 

           13              those in favor?  Aye.

 

           14                      MS. FANUCCI: Aye.

 

           15                      MR. COURTRIGHT: Aye.

 

           16                      MS. GATELLI: The ayes have it and so

 

           17              moved.

 

           18                      MS. GARVEY: 6-B. READING BY TITLE -

 

           19              FILE OF COUNCIL NO. 63, 2009 - AN ORDINANCE

 

           20              - AUTHORIZING THE MAYOR AND OTHER

 

           21              APPROPRIATE OFFICIALS OF THE CITY OF

 

           22              SCRANTON TO ACCEPT AND DISBURSE GRANT FUNDS

 

           23              FROM LACKAWANNA COUNTY CHILDREN AND YOUTH

 

           24              SERVICES AND DEPARTMENT OF ARTS AND CULTURE

 

           25              A.R.T.S. ENGAGE!  GRANT IN THE AMOUNT OF


 

 

                                                                     127

 

 

            1              $34,100.00 FOR THE CITY OF SCRANTON

 

            2              DEPARTMENT OF PARKS AND RECREATION POOL

 

            3              MURALS PROGRAM.

 

            4                      MS. GATELLI: You have heard reading

 

            5              by title of Item 6-B, what is your pleasure?

 

            6                      MR. COURTRIGHT:  I move that Item

 

            7              6-B pass reading by title.

 

            8                      MS. FANUCCI: Second.

 

            9                      MS. GATELLI: On the question?

 

           10                      MR. COURTRIGHT: On the question,

 

           11              Mrs. Garvey, I know Mrs. Evans raised some

 

           12              questions on this last week and I can't

 

           13              remember what they were, but someone had

 

           14              mentioned sometimes to me when we have

 

           15              nonprofits, I don't know to get the

 

           16              hospitals mad at me, such as a hospital that

 

           17              the CEO makes an exorbitant amount of money,

 

           18              can we just see what the salary is for

 

           19              whoever?  I'm not even quite sure, what's

 

           20              the name of this group?

 

           21                      MS. GATELLI: It's Children and

 

           22              Youth, Lackawanna County Children and Youth.

 

           23                      MR. COURTRIGHT: Is that who it's

 

           24              going through?

 

           25                      MS. GATELLI:  Yes.


 

 

                                                                     128

 

 

            1                      MS. FANUCCI: Yes.

 

            2                      MR. COURTRIGHT:  Is there another

 

            3              organization?  Is it just Children and

 

            4              Youth?

 

            5                      MS. GATELLI: Yeah, Children and

 

            6              Youth for both, for all of these.  Arts

 

            7              Engaged Program.  I'm sure they are going to

 

            8              get --

 

            9                      MR. COURTRIGHT: So Children and

 

           10              Youth governs the arts --

 

           11                      MS. GATELLI: Yes.

 

           12                      MR. COURTRIGHT: -- program, they

 

           13              will be running it?

 

           14                      MS. GATELLI: Yes, through the

 

           15              county.

 

           16                      MR. COURTRIGHT: Then I don't need to

 

           17              ask that question the, I'm sorry.

 

           18                      MS. GATELLI: Anyone else on the

 

           19              question?  All in favor?

 

           20                      MR. COURTRIGHT: Aye.

 

           21                      MS. FANUCCI: Aye.

 

           22                      MS GATELLI: Aye.  Opposed?  The ayes

 

           23              have it and so moved.  Motion to adjourn.

 

           24                      MR. COURTRIGHT: So moved.

 

           25                      MS. GARVEY: Seventh order there was


 

 

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            1              no business.

 

            2                      MS. GATELLI: Motion to adjourn.

 

            3                      MR. COURTRIGHT: So moved.

 

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            3                     C E R T I F I C A T E

 

            4

 

            5        I hereby certify that the proceedings and

 

            6   evidence are contained fully and accurately in the

 

            7   notes of testimony taken by me at the hearing of the

 

            8   above-captioned matter and that the foregoing is a true

 

            9   and correct transcript of the same to the best of my

 

           10   ability.

 

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                                    CATHENE S. NARDOZZI, RPR

           14                       OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER

 

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