1


1 SCRANTON CITY COUNCIL MEETING

2

3

4

5 HELD:

6

7 Thursday, July 19, 2007

8

9 LOCATION:

10 Council Chambers

11 Scranton City Hall

12 340 North Washington Avenue

13 Scranton, Pennsylvania

14

15

16

17

18

19

20

21

22

23
CATHENE S. NARDOZZI - COURT REPORTER
24

25
.

2


1

2 CITY OF SCRANTON COUNCIL:

3

4
MS. JUDY GATELLI, PRESIDENT
5

6 MS. JANET E. EVANS

7
MS. SHERRY FANUCCI
8

9 MR. ROBERT MCGOFF

10
MR. WILLIAM COURTRIGHT
11

12 MS. KAY GARVEY, CITY CLERK

13
MR. NEIL COOLICAN, ASSISTANT CITY CLERK
14

15 MR. AMIL MINORA, SOLICITOR

16

17

18

19

20

21

22

23

24

25
.

3


1 (Pledge of Allegiance recited and moment of

2 reflection.)

3 MS. GATELLI: Roll call.

4 MR. COOLICAN: Mrs. Evans.

5 MRS. EVANS: Here.

6 MR. COOLICAN: Mrs. Fanucci.

7 MS. FANUCCI: Here.

8 MR. COOLICAN: Mr. McGoff.

9 MR. MCGOFF: Here.

10 MR. COOLICAN: Mr. Courtright.

11 MR. COURTRIGHT: Here.

12 MR. COOLICAN: Mrs. Gatelli.

13 MS. GATELLI: Here. Dispense with

14 the reading of the minutes.

15 MS. GARVEY: Third order. 3-A.

16 APPLICATIONS AND DECISIONS RENDERED BY THE

17 ZONING HEARING BOARD ON WEDNESDAY, JULY 11,

18 2007.

19 MR. GATELLI: Are there any

20 comments? If not, received and filed.

21 MS. GARVEY: 3-B. AGENDA FOR THE CITY

22 PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING HELD ON JULY 17,

23 2007.

24 MS. GATELLI: Are there are comments?

25 If not, received and filed.
.

4


1 MS. GARVEY: 3-C. CONTROLLER'S REPORT

2 FOR THE MONTH ENDING JUNE 30, 2007.

3 MS. GATELLI: Are there any comments?

4 If not, received and filed.

5 MS. GARVEY: That's all for Third

6 Order.

7 MS. GATELLI: Before we start with

8 motions, I just have a few announcements.

9 As you all know, there was a fire that

10 occurred in the city and some people were

11 rescued. They were rescued by firefighers

12 Dan Hanley and Paul Schirra and two DPW

13 workers who happened to be driving by went

14 in and rescued the mother, Mrs. Farley, Kim

15 Kandel and Jim Reed. Any donations may be

16 sent to the David Bradshaw Relief Fund care

17 of PNC Bank 1902 North Main Avenue, 18508.

18 And I would also like Kay to setup

19 proclamations for these people. If we can

20 get it by next Thursday it would be nice, if

21 not, we will do it when we come back.

22 MS. KAY: Is that all four --

23 MS. GATELLI: Yes. There will be a

24 jazz festival next week at the Radisson.

25 The festival is the third, fourth and fifth
.

5


1 and they will be all day long. There is a

2 schedule in the newspaper.

3 And I received a letter last week

4 from a gentleman and I also heard from

5 several other people about the DPW not

6 picking up cardboard when they were picking

7 up recycling. They were leaving the

8 cardboard at the curb, so I talked to the

9 recycling center and Neil also called and

10 they said that they will take cardboard if

11 it is brought there by the citizen

12 themselves. They will not take commingled

13 paper and cardboard from the city, so I

14 talked to Jeff Brazil and he said that is

15 indeed true, and it would all have to be

16 separated, and he is going to look into

17 picking up cardboard at least on a once a

18 month basis, so I will keep you informed of

19 that, but be aware that the city will not

20 pick up cardboard from your recycling pile

21 for the present time.

22 I also was looking into Municipal

23 Revenue Service legislation that was put on

24 hold several months ago and we got an

25 interest from another company. I had been
.

6


1 in touch with Mr. Smith and Michelle Bordner

2 from that particular company and they have

3 since submitted a proposal that I haven't

4 seen except for on my e-mail. I will be

5 getting a hard copy, I believe that

6 Mr. Krushefski has one so, Kay, if you would

7 get a copy for the rest of Council and they

8 can look that over and we can possibly meet

9 with them when we come back and we'll see

10 how the two proposals compare, and that's

11 all I have.

12 MR. COURTRIGHT: I have two, if you

13 don't mind.

14 MS. GARVEY: Sure.

15 MR. COURTRIGHT: You know, I'm not in

16 the habit of announcing when people pass

17 away because of the fact I'm afraid I will

18 exclude somebody and I did that. Doc

19 Doherty, I want to send my condolences to

20 his family, he died back on July 1 and he

21 volunteered for over 20 years in the school

22 district and in the city and I didn't

23 mention him, he is going to be deeply missed

24 so I apologize for not mentioning that, and

25 just one more, Sonny Sentile passed away and
.

7


1 I've known the family my entire life since I

2 was born and I just want to send my

3 condolences to them. And I was asked out in

4 the hallway, and I didn't know the answer,

5 they asked me if Mr. Dougher is going to be

6 here today, and I just got a letter that is

7 stamped in our office at 11:55 he will be

8 out of town today so he won't be able to

9 come to our meeting, but he gave us a

10 listing of the damages for the pool at

11 Capouse Avenue. That's it. Thank you.

12 MS. GATELLI: Thank you. Anyone

13 else? Motions. Ms. Evans?

14 MS. EVANS: Good afternoon. In

15 response to questions posed during the

16 meeting of July 12, 2007, I'd like it

17 provide the following response:

18 Mr. Hazzouri, pavecut inspector,

19 states that paving of Diamond Avenue should

20 begin by Wednesday, July 25, 2007. The cost

21 for the Connell Park dog park include a

22 lengthy list, but I believe there have been

23 many questions about that, so I'll get

24 through it as quickly as possible:

25 Patch seal and topcoat, two inches
.

8


1 existing asphalt, $43,986. Saw cut, remove

2 old pave, $3,960. Clear and grub, $1,200.

3 Fill existing pool, $8,000. A six-foot

4 vinyl coated chain link fence, $46,050. A

5 safety gate with vinyl coating, $4,200. A

6 time out box, there are two of them, $1,600.

7 Stock pile, place boulders, $10,500. Six

8 benches, $5,400. Asphalt, a three-inch base

9 with two-inch wearing $245. A six-inch

10 subbase, $675. The lawn, $4,787. Top soil,

11 $15,750. Stone subbase, $12,250. Stone

12 dust surface, $16,250. Pea gravel, $10,300.

13 Trash receptacle, six, $3,000. Water doggy

14 bag station, $800, and there are two of

15 those. Six fire hydrants $1,500, although,

16 I believe the water company was going to

17 donate some fire hydrants so that cost is

18 probably going to be eliminated. A two-inch

19 water line $11,500. Valve box frost free

20 fixture, two of those, $2,400. Lawn

21 irrigation system $12,000. Two rule signs,

22 $600 for a sub total of $216,953. A

23 15 percent contingency at $32,543 for a sum

24 total of $249,496.53.

25 And probably if you are questioning
.

9


1 all of the asphalt and stone subbase and

2 clearing and grub and such, there is a

3 walking trail that goes all the way around

4 that park and I believe connects to another

5 area of the park, so that is included

6 because it circles the dog park, so it's not

7 only the dog park it's the walking trail as

8 well.

9 Also, proposals for the Crisp Avenue

10 culvert replacement will be open on

11 August 3. This much needed project is in

12 process and I'm sure that's a great relief

13 to area residents.

14 I have spent the last few days

15 volunteering at St. Ann's Novena which I

16 have done for the past three summers since

17 my father passed away, Carl Tomko. He

18 volunteered for close to 50 years at both

19 the weekly Novena and the annual nine-day

20 solemn Novena to St. Ann and I wanted to

21 carry on his tradition. Although, frankly,

22 I don't do half the job that he does or did

23 and I only tell you this as background for

24 what I want to say today. I have spoken to

25 countless city residents in the last two
.

10


1 days, senior citizens, those with illnesses

2 and disabilities and working families and

3 what they tell me ask that they have great

4 fear. Fear of tax reassessments by the

5 county, fear of tax increases by the city

6 and the school district, fear of fees,

7 fines, costs and penalties that are incurred

8 in the collection of delinquent taxes. Fear

9 of sewer rate increases.

10 Others tell me of terrible problems

11 and mistakes that have been made by NCC in

12 the collection of delinquencies and, sadly,

13 there are those who fear they are losing

14 their homes and one woman who told me that

15 her neighbors now have lost their home and

16 she is asking her husband if she can take

17 that family in at least temporarily until

18 they can find somewhere to live and get back

19 on their feet.

20 Others tell me about losing their

21 jobs and the senior citizens, of course,

22 describe what life on SSI is like and very

23 small pensions perhaps from railroad

24 retirement or whatever their line of service

25 had been through the years. One man even
.

11


1 needed money to purchase -- to be able to

2 purchase all of his medication, and I'll

3 tell you, I think any elected official only

4 needs to spend -- you don't have to spend

5 the ten days, if you spend just one day,

6 eight hours out among the public then you

7 would realize the hardships of the people of

8 this city and you would think twice about

9 tax increases. You would think twice about

10 any additional costs that burden these

11 people further.

12 You know, the city has gone well

13 beyond the debt limits of it's people and

14 our bond rating has plummeted according to

15 Standard and Poors and, you know, it's

16 something that I talked about for years,

17 but, that S&P report proves it. More so,

18 the people of this city prove it to me

19 everyday, everyday that I'm over there

20 because of what they are suffering, what

21 they have lost and the fear that they live

22 in everyday.

23 And I have to thank God I'm not in

24 this circumstance, certainly I'm not the

25 wealthiest woman in town, but I'm not the
.

12


1 poorest either. I'm blessed in many ways,

2 I'm blessed I have a job, a full-time job.

3 I'm blessed because that job gives me

4 security that other people in other fields

5 don't have, they could be out of a job at

6 any time, but as a teacher I'm guaranteed my

7 employment. I'm blessed to be a city

8 council woman. I'm blessed to have a roof

9 over my head, food on my table and to have

10 reasonably good health. I'm blessed to

11 still have my mother. I'm blessed for the

12 children and grandchildren I have, but so

13 many very good people of this city don't

14 have those same blessings and I just -- I

15 can't in good conscience allow more

16 borrowing. I can't in good conscience allow

17 tax increases because I know the effect that

18 it is having and certainly there are many,

19 many projects that would justify such

20 borrowing, tax increases etcetera, but they

21 aren't the necessities and right now so many

22 in our city are denied the necessities of

23 life. Medication, a roof over their heads,

24 food, peace of mind.

25 And as I said earlier, I know that I
.

13


1 have been fighting hard all of these years

2 against borrowing every December, against

3 job creations, looking for balanced budgets,

4 looking for ways to increase revenue and by

5 and large I haven't been successful in those

6 endeavors. I have tried, I have let you

7 know, but, nevertheless, having met all of

8 the very good, very kind people who have

9 such faith, still have such faith in God and

10 obviously have faith in the elected

11 officials and enough faith to talk to me

12 about their problems. You know, as much as

13 we'd like it, God can't come and solve all

14 of the problems, but I think God works

15 through people and as elected officials I do

16 believe we have to be very, very conscious

17 of the population we serve. It's not just

18 the businesses, it's just not the

19 developers, certainly they are a portion of

20 it, but they are blessed people and as

21 government officials we have to do the

22 greatest good for the greatest number of

23 people and cause the fewest people the least

24 amount of harm possible.

25 So as I have done in the past I'm
.

14


1 going to continue to do it and even

2 fervently more so. I'm not going to inflict

3 further financial burdens, I'm going to try

4 to do my best for every one, and I'm only

5 one person and I'm only one vote, but I can

6 assure you that that vote will always take

7 you into consideration and will always

8 represent you because I don't believe in

9 isolation. I do understand, I really do.

10 I also wanted to announce in

11 advance, and then I'm going to get right

12 into citizens' requests. I'm going to be

13 late to next week's meeting, not terribly

14 late, but I will be late because there will

15 be a mass at St. Ann's for the sole of my

16 father. I arranged that mass each year on

17 the feast day of St. Ann to honor him and

18 his volunteerism there for 50 years, so as

19 soon as the mass concludes I will report

20 directly to city council, and these are the

21 weeks requests:

22 A letter to Jeff Brazil, DPW, please

23 fill potholes in the 100 block of Ridgeview

24 Drive, particularly in front of 114

25 Ridgeview Drive. The 1500 block of Von
.

15


1 Storch Avenue, repair potholes. Residents

2 report that their houses shake as trucks hit

3 these gapping holes each day, this is the

4 second request.

5 Repair a large depression in Smith

6 place, an alley behind Watson Street. Also,

7 repair potholes in front of a carport in

8 Smith Place, and this is the second request.

9 Repair potholes in Park Gardens behind the

10 following building numbers, 17 through 21,

11 and should the city not be responsible for

12 that area then, Kay, I would like to that

13 letter please forwarded to the Scranton

14 Housing Authority. Residents are unable to

15 park their cars back there and they are

16 damaging their cars in the attempt to do so.

17 Kay, Hollister Avenue which consists of

18 only two or three blocks following the

19 completion of the Weston Park project, these

20 blocks resemble a washboard and present a

21 very poor appearance surrounding the

22 improvements to the park.

23 A letter to Mark Dougher, Parks and

24 Rec, please clean graffiti at Dorothy Street

25 playground. A resident of the neighborhood,
.

16


1 Mr. Narsavage, regularly picks up garbage

2 and cleans graffiti and the playground and

3 the area should be regularly checked and

4 cleaned by the city rather than by a senior

5 citizen.

6 A letter to Jeff Brazil, would it be

7 possible to purchase the necessary equipment

8 to clean graffiti throughout the city? This

9 information was forwarded several months ago

10 to Mr. Parker who failed to respond. City

11 Director Don McKeean is very familiar with

12 these issues and could lead a graffiti task

13 force successfully to eliminate this

14 dangerous form of blight. Not only could

15 the equipment be utilized by the DPW and the

16 Parks and Recreation Department, but also by

17 residents and businesses who can borrow the

18 equipment after providing a security deposit

19 which would be refunded at such time as they

20 return the equipment to the DPW thereby,

21 offering an immediate remedy to gang related

22 communications.

23 A letter to Chief Elliott and I'm

24 requesting a copy of a police report that

25 relates to a vehicle accident in West
.

17


1 Scranton where motorists are continuing to

2 speed through a stop sign. Rolland Avenue

3 located between Brooke and Cherry Street,

4 install a curb lip which was destroyed by

5 snow plows in 2007. Residential properties

6 are damaged by water runoff during each

7 rainfall event, and this is the second

8 request.

9 The 1400 block of Dickson Avenue, no

10 recyclables have been collected in three

11 weeks. Residents spoke to the DPW, but

12 there have been no results. Shay Place in

13 rear of Moosic Street, residents report an

14 overgrown lot an in which rodents have been

15 observed. Obviously, the citizens of

16 Scranton have quite a number of problems and

17 with the taxes we are all paying I do expect

18 that those problems are going to be taken

19 care of, and that's it.

20 MS. GATELLI: Thank you.

21 Mrs. Fanucci?

22 MS. FANUCCI: Yes. There are two

23 things on the agenda today which are in my

24 committee and I wanted to report on them.

25 There is a one building, that's called Posh
.

18


1 Light, LLG, they are looking for a loan.

2 This industry started as a catering business

3 in New York City in 1999. The property is

4 at 401 Jefferson Avenue, it's called the

5 Colonnade, I'm sure you'll start to

6 understand exactly which building it is. It

7 was purchased for $225,000 and they are

8 establishing a full specially run operation

9 offering catering as well as event planning

10 and a boutique. They need working capital

11 for the project, primarily, architectural.

12 If you went by this building you will see

13 why they need the architectural. Phase one

14 they have already completed. The project

15 included internal restoration including new

16 electrical system, heating, cooling system

17 and plumbing. The facade will be restored

18 into it's original condition with this

19 architectural -- it's the one with the big

20 white pillars. It's an absolutely

21 incredible, beautiful home which they have

22 saved and are putting their money into and

23 helping to rebuild. It's absolutely

24 beautiful. This home was built in 1973 and

25 the building was remodeled in 1910 when the
.

19


1 columns on the third floor ballroom were

2 added and in the 1950's the home was

3 purchased by the Munchaks and recently

4 owned, Irene Munchak owed the home and would

5 not sell it to anyone who was planning on

6 tearing it down, she made sure that someone

7 who was going to buy this property made sure

8 they restored it back to their flooring and

9 it's a wonderful project.

10 There will be up to ten employees

11 that they will hire to see the day-to-day

12 operations and special events will be

13 on-site as well as offsite so there will be

14 catering involved. They are going to have a

15 general manager, some chef positions, event

16 planner, hotel staff, event staff, valet,

17 all are planned to be the team for the

18 colonnade. They also are going to have

19 three or four suites upstairs that can be

20 rented and attending by the people who may

21 be downstairs at one of the events, which is

22 a great idea so it would sort of be sort of

23 like a bed and breakfast deal also, so that

24 is the first one that is on and ten

25 employees is a great addition and the
.

20


1 building is absolutely beautiful, so I want

2 to wish them a lot of luck with that and

3 heavily support the project.

4 The other is, and I never say this

5 right, Kelbri Development, LLC. This is a

6 real estate holding company formed for the

7 purpose of purchasing and developing

8 property located at 313-317 Linden Street.

9 Thomas Davis acquired this property in

10 February of 2006 and engaged in two phases

11 of a third, and three-phase project.

12 The first phase consisted of gutting

13 the structure, new mechanical, electrical,

14 plumbing seems to be what everyone has to do

15 to put in a fire protection system and 1,000

16 square foot porch were added to the phase.

17 The second phase will consist of outfitting

18 the first floor side portion with two floor

19 structures for commercial and retail space.

20 The first floor presently occupied by a

21 long-term established business, successful.

22 And the third floor will end up to be

23 renovated for architectural, additional

24 commercial lease space and engineering costs

25 ill all be incurred in this space, so they
.

21


1 are going to cover the engineering costs,

2 the architectural costs and also some of the

3 new building renovations. This project will

4 result in the creation of eight full-time

5 jobs and three within three years to the

6 date of the loan, so they are borrowing also

7 $250,000 for a 20-year term and I believe

8 this one is a Community Development Block

9 Grant Fund. So both of these projects are

10 very large and very costly, but I think are

11 put into good business in the city. Any

12 time that you save an old building, as far

13 as I'm concerned, is a good thing, so that

14 is all I have. Thank you.

15 MS. GATELLI: Thank you.

16 Mr. McGoff.

17 MR. MCGOFF: Nothing today. Thank

18 you.

19 MS. GATELLI: Mr. Courtright.

20 MR. COURTRIGHT: Yes. I think most

21 of you know I have been trying to get a

22 project under way on Main Avenue that is

23 going to bring curbs, sidewalks, period

24 lighting and then possibly underground

25 utilities so I was happy to hear that the
.

22


1 city is going after the state to get some

2 money to do that project and I many really

3 hoping that that comes to be, so I was happy

4 to hear that. A lot of people have been

5 asking me about that, asking me if that

6 project is dead. I had been in touch once

7 with the mayor and he told me it wasn't dead

8 so evidently we are going to be moving ahead

9 on that.

10 I spoke to Mr. Ludovici there was a

11 problem up in Fawnwood with a waterline and

12 they cleared that out. He said that they

13 were down there on Luzerne Street, the woman

14 that was here last week that had that

15 problem they are working on that problem now

16 and then there is also a problem at the

17 bottom of St. Ann's Street and Main Avenue

18 and they were going to go out there this

19 morning and he said take a look at it, I

20 don't know if they are able to due to all of

21 the traffic from the Novena, so I want to

22 thank them for getting on top of those

23 things for me. Again, as I said,

24 Mr. Dougher couldn't make it here today, he

25 is out of town, so we will have to wait for
.

23


1 his answer.

2 One thing that I have noticed in the

3 past year or so, I think we are getting a

4 lot more citizens' requests and especially a

5 lot more citizens' request by e-mail and

6 what I have done the last couple of weeks

7 and it seemed to work for me is rather than

8 me sending a letter every time somebody

9 e-mails me for something like I was to try

10 and e-mail that individual back and tell

11 them I was forward to the proper person, try

12 to save Neil and Kay and Sue a lot of work

13 with all of these letters because we send

14 out a lot of letters. I think they spend a

15 lot of their time sending out letters and

16 what I found out is not only is it saving

17 time, but I have gotten a quick response. I

18 have sent, I believe it was Monday I sent

19 three requests to Mr. Brazil Monday morning

20 and when I came back in Tuesday morning he

21 had e-mailed me back and said he was going

22 to take care of it so I think it cut out a

23 little bit of paperwork and sometimes when I

24 send a letter I never get an answer, so at

25 least I'm getting an answer here. So, if by
.

24


1 some reason you send me a request, I want to

2 answer you back and forwarded it the proper

3 official, I think it's going to be a little

4 more efficient for me by doing an e-mail, so

5 if you don't get -- sometimes I male a

6 letter out to you that I sent so you could

7 see I sent it, but I'm just going to e-mail

8 back to you. Those of you that call me by

9 phone or requesting the letter I will

10 certainly send a letter out, but I have been

11 a little bit more luck with the e-mail, so

12 I'm going to try and do it that way. And

13 that's all I have. Thank you.

14 MS. GATELLI: Thank you.

15 Mrs. Garvey?

16 MS. GARVEY: 4-B - FOR INTRODUCTION

17 - AN ORDINANCE ESTABLISHING A REGISTRATION

18 PROGRAM FOR RESIDENTIAL RENTAL PROPERTIES

19 REQUIRING ALL OWNERS OF RESIDENTIAL RENTAL

20 PROPERTIES TO DESIGNATE AN AGENT FOR SERVICE

21 OF PROCESS AND PRESCRIBING DUTIES OF OWNERS,

22 AGENTS AND OCCUPANTS; DIRECTING THE

23 DESIGNATION OF AGENTS; ESTABLISHING FEES FOR

24 THE COSTS ASSOCIATED WITH REGISTRATION OF

25 RENTAL PROPERTY; AND PRESCRIBING PENALTIES
.

25


1 FOR VIOLATIONS.

2 MS. GATELLI: At this time I'll

3 entertain a motion that 4-B be introduced.

4 MR. COURTRIGHT: So moved.

5 MS. FANUCCI: Second.

6 MS. GATELLI: On the question? All

7 those in favor?

8 MS. EVANS: Aye.

9 MS. FANUCCI: Aye.

10 MR. MCGOFF: Aye.

11 MR. COURTRIGHT: Aye.

12 MS. GATELLI: Aye. Opposed? The

13 ayes have it and so moved.

14 MS. GARVEY: 4-C- FOR INTRODUCTION -

15 AN ORDINANCE - AUTHORIZING THE CONVEYANCE BY

16 SEALED BID OR AUCTION OF ONE PARCEL OF

17 PROPERTY LOCATED INT HE CITY OF SCRANTON AT

18 1008 FISK STREET, AND RECORDED AT RECORD

19 BOOK R062, PAGE 3895.

20 MS. GATELLI: At this time I'll

21 entertain a motion that 4-C be introduced.

22 MR. COURTRIGHT: So moved.

23 MS. FANUCCI: Second.

24 MS. GATELLI: On the question? All

25 those in favor?
.

26


1 MS. EVANS: Aye.

2 MS. FANUCCI: Aye.

3 MR. MCGOFF: Aye.

4 MR. COURTRIGHT: Aye.

5 MS. GATELLI: Aye. Opposed? The

6 ayes have it and so moved.

7 MS. GARVEY: 4-D - FOR INTRODUCTION -

8 AN ORDINANCE - AMENDING FILE OF COUNCIL NO.

9 155 OF 2005, ENTITLED, "AN ORDINANCE

10 AUTHORIZING THE MAYOR AND OTHER APPROPRIATE

11 OFFICIALS OF THE CITY OF SCRANTON TO TAKE

12 ALL NECESSARY ACTIONS TO IMPLEMENT THE

13 CONSOLIDATED SUBMISSION FOR COMMUNITY

14 PLANNING AND DEVELOPMENT PROGRAMS (AS

15 AMENDED) TO BE FUNDED UNDER THE COMMUNITY

16 DEVELOPMENT BLOCK GRANT (CDBG) PROGRAM, HOME

17 INVESTMENT PARTNERSHIP (HOME) PROGRAM AND

18 EMERGENCY SHELTER GRANT (ESG) PROGRAM", BY

19 TRANSFERRING $50,000.00, FROM PROJECT NO.

20 06-33 CONTINGENCY TO PROJECT NO. 06.229.6

21 UNC COMMUNITY SERVICE BUILDING.

22 MS. GATELLI: At this time I'll

23 entertain a motion that 4-D be introduced.

24 MR. COURTRIGHT: So moved.

25 MR. MCGOFF: Second.
.

27


1 MS. GATELLI: On the question? All

2 in favor.

3 MS. EVANS: Aye.

4 MS. FANUCCI: Aye.

5 MR. MCGOFF: Aye.

6 MR. COURTRIGHT: Aye.

7 MS. GATELLI: Aye. Opposed? The

8 ayes have it and so moved.

9 MS. GARVEY: 4-E FOR INTRODUCTION - A

10 RESOLUTION - AUTHORIZING THE MAYOR AND OTHER

11 APPROPRIATE CITY OFFICIALS FOR THE CITY OF

12 SCRANTON TO ENTER INTO A LOAN AGREEMENT AND

13 MAKE A LOAN FROM THE COMMUNITY DEVELOPMENT

14 BLOCK GRANT LOAN PROGRAM, PROJECT NO.

15 03-150.12 IN AN AMOUNT NOT TO EXCEED

16 $250,000 TO KELBRI DEVELOPMENT, LLC TO

17 ASSIST AN ELIGIBLE PROJECT.

18 MS. GATELLI: At this time I'll

19 entertain a motion that 4-E be introduced.

20 MR. COURTRIGHT: So moved.

21 MS. FANUCCI: Second.

22 MS. GATELLI: On the question.

23 MR. COURTRIGHT: On the question very

24 quickly, Mrs. Gatelli, when I was looking

25 into this legislation I did find out that a
.

28


1 portion of the money is going to be used for

2 an elevator so that the second floor can be

3 accessible for handicap people.

4 MS. GATELLI: Anyone else? All

5 those in favor?

6 MS. FANUCCI: Aye.

7 MR. MCGOFF: Aye.

8 MR. COURTRIGHT: Aye.

9 MS. GATELLI: Aye. Opposed?

10 MS. EVANS: No.

11 MS. GATELLI: The ayes have it and so

12 move by a vote of 4 to 1.

13 MS. GARVEY: 4-F - FOR INTRODUCTION -

14 A RESOLUTION - AUTHORIZING THE MAYOR AND

15 OTHER APPROPRIATE CITY OFFICIALS TO EXECUTE

16 AND ENTER INTO A LOAN AGREEMENT AND TO

17 EXECUTE A PROMISSORY NOTE, IN THE AMOUNT OF

18 $250,000 BY AND BETWEEN THE CITY OF SCRANTON

19 AND POSH LIFE, LLC FOR ENTERPRISE ZONE

20 COMPETITIVE GRANT FUNDS TO DEDICATED TO THE

21 POSH LIFE, LLC PROJECT.

22 MS. GATELLI: At this time I'll

23 entertain a motion that 4-F be introduced.

24 MR. COURTRIGHT: So moved.

25 MS. FANUCCI: Second.
.

29


1 MS. GATELLI: On the question? All

2 those in favor.

3 MS. EVANS: Aye.

4 MS. FANUCCI: Aye.

5 MR. MCGOFF: Aye.

6 MR. COURTRIGHT: Aye.

7 MS. GATELLI: Aye. Opposed? The

8 ayes have it and so moved.

9 MS. GARVEY: 4-G - FOR INTRODUCTION -

10 A RESOLUTION - AUTHORIZING THE MAYOR AND

11 OTHER APPROPRIATE CITY OFFICIALS TO EXECUTE

12 AND ENTER INTO ANY DOCUMENTS NEEDED TO

13 SUBMIT AND DESIGNATE THE REDEVELOPMENT

14 AUTHORITY OF THE CITY OF SCRANTON AS THE

15 LOCAL REDEVELOPMENT AUTHORITY, AT THAT TERM

16 IS UNDERSTOOD BY THE OFFICE OF ECONOMIC

17 ADJUSTMENT OF THE DEPARTMENT OF DEFENSE, FOR

18 THE PURPOSE OF COORDINATING THE

19 REDEVELOPMENT OF THE SAMUEL SERENTI ARMY

20 RESERVE CENTER ON COLFAX AVENUE.

21 MS. GATELLI: At this time I'll

22 entertain a motion that 4-G be introduced.

23 MR. COURTRIGHT: So moved.

24 MS. FANUCCI: Second.

25 MS. GATELLI: On the question? All
.

30


1 those in favor?

2 MS. EVANS: Aye.

3 MS. FANUCCI: Aye.

4 MR. MCGOFF: Aye.

5 MR. COURTRIGHT: Aye.

6 MS. GATELLI: Aye. Opposed? The

7 ayes have it and so moved.

8 MS. GARVEY: 4-H - FOR INTRODUCTION -

9 A RESOLUTION - AUTHORIZING THE FILING OF A

10 PROPOSAL FOR FUNDS WITH THE DEPARTMENT OF

11 COMMUNITY AND ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT (DECED),

12 COMMONWEALTH OF PENNSYLVANIA AND AUTHORIZING

13 THE MAYOR AND OTHER APPROPRIATE CITY

14 OFFICIALS TO EXECUTE AND APPLY FOR SAID

15 GRANT FOR HOUSING AND REDEVELOPMENT

16 ASSISTANCE THROUGH DECD; ACCEPTING THE GRANT

17 IF THE GRANT APPLICATION IS SUCCESSFUL, AND

18 COORDINATING THE USE OF THE GRANT FUNDS

19 THROUGH THE PROGRAMS RUN BY UNITED

20 NEIGHBORHOOD CENTERS OF LACKAWANNA COUNTY.

21 MS. GATELLI: At this time I'll

22 entertain a motion that 4-H be introduced.

23 MR. COURTRIGHT: So moved.

24 MS. FANUCCI: Second.

25 MS. GATELLI: On the question? All
.

31


1 those in favor?

2 MS. EVANS: Aye.

3 MS. FANUCCI: Aye.

4 MR. MCGOFF: Aye.

5 MR. COURTRIGHT: Aye.

6 MS. GATELLI: Aye. Opposed? The

7 ayes have it and so moved.

8 MS. GARVEY: 4-I FOR INTRODUCTION -

9 A RESOLUTION - AUTHORIZING THE MAYOR AND

10 OTHER APPROPRIATE CITY OFFICIALS TO EXECUTE

11 AND ENTER INTO A SUPPLEMENTAL REIMBURSEMENT

12 AGREEMENT NO. 040928-F WITH THE COMMONWEALTH

13 OF PENNSYLVANIA, DEPARTMENT OF

14 TRANSPORTATION ("PENNDOT") FOR THE PURPOSE

15 OF INCREASING THE FUNDS ALLOCATED FOR THE

16 CONSTRUCTION PHASE OF THE EAST MARKET STREET

17 BRIDGE PROJECT.

18 MS. GATELLI: At this time I'll

19 entertain a motion that 4-I be introduced.

20 MR. COURTRIGHT: So moved.

21 MS. FANUCCI: Second.

22 MS. GATELLI: On the question? All

23 those in favor?

24 MS. EVANS: Aye.

25 MS. FANUCCI: Aye.
.

32


1 MR. MCGOFF: Aye.

2 MR. COURTRIGHT: Aye.

3 MS. GATELLI: Aye. Opposed? The

4 ayes have it and so moved.

5 MS. GARVEY: FIFTH ORDER - 5-A -

6 READING BY TITLE - FILE OF COUNCIL NO. 103,

7 2007 - AN ORDINANCE - AUTHORIZING THE MAYOR

8 AND OTHER APPROPRIATE CITY OFFICIALS TO

9 APPLY FOR AND EXECUTE A GRANT APPLICATION

10 AND IF SUCCESSFUL A GRANT AGREEMENT AND

11 ACCEPT THE FUNDS RELATED THERETO THROUGH THE

12 EDWARD J. BYRNE JUSTICE ASSISTANCE GRANT

13 ("JAG") FORMERLY KNOWN AS THE LOCAL LAW

14 ENFORCEMENT BLOCK GRANT (LLEBG).

15 MS. GATELLI: You have heard Reading

16 by Title of 5-A, what is your pleasure?

17 MR. COURTRIGHT: I move that Item 5-A

18 pass Reading by Title.

19 MS. FANUCCI: Second.

20 MS. GATELLI: On the question? All

21 those in favor?

22 MS. EVANS: Aye.

23 MS. FANUCCI: Aye.

24 MR. MCGOFF: Aye.

25 MR. COURTRIGHT: Aye.
.

33


1 MS. GATELLI: Aye. Opposed? The

2 ayes have it and so moved.

3 MS. GARVEY: 5-B. READING BY TITLE -

4 FILE OF COUNCIL NO. 104, 2007 - AN ORDINANCE

5 - DECLARING (1) THE ACQUISITION OF PARKING

6 FACILITIES BY THE PARKING AUTHORITY OF THE

7 CITY OF SCRANTON, PENNSYLVANIA AND THE

8 ASSOCIATED REFUNDING OF THE REDEVELOPMENT

9 AUTHORITY OF THE CITY OF SCRANTON GUARANTEED

10 VARIABLE RATE DEMAND LEASE REVENUE BONDS,

11 SERIES OF 2004, ISSUED TO FINANCE SUCH

12 PARKING FACILITIES, (2) THE ACQUISITION,

13 CONSTRUCTION AND EQUIPPING OF NEW PARKING

14 FACILITIES OF THE PARKING AUTHORITY OF THE

15 CITY OF SCRANTON, PENNSYLVANIA AND LOCATED

16 IN THE CITY OF SCRANTON AND OPERATED BY THE

17 CITY PURSUANT TO AN OPERATING AGREEMENT, AND

18 (4) THE FINANCING OF NECESSARY RESERVES,

19 CAPITALIZED INTEREST AND COSTS OF ISSUANCE

20 OF THE HEREINAFTER MENTIONED 2007 BONDS, TO

21 BE A PROJECT OF THE CITY FOR WHICH LEASE

22 RENTAL DEB IS TO BE INCURRED; DETERMINING TO

23 INCURE LEASE RENTAL DEB IN THE MAXIMUM

24 AMOUNT OF $35,000,000 IN RESPECT OF THE

25 PROJECT, SUCH DEBT TO BE EVIDENCED BY
.

34


1 RENTALS PAYABLE TO THE AUTHORITY BY THE CITY

2 UNDER A LEASE (INCLUDING A FIFTH

3 SUPPLEMENTAL LEASE) OF THE PARKING

4 FACILITIES, AND BY A COVENANT OF GUARANTY OF

5 THE CITY CONTAINED IN SAID FIFTY

6 SUPPLEMENTAL LEASE; STATING THE ESTIMATED

7 REALISTIC USEFUL LIVES OF THE PARKING

8 FACILITIES; AUTHORIZING CERTAIN CITY

9 OFFICERS TO PREPARE, CERTIFY AND FILE WIT

10 THE DEPARTMENT OF COMMUNITY AND ECONOMIC

11 DEVELOPMENT THE DEBT STATEMENT REQUIRED BY

12 SECTION 8110 OF THE LOCAL GOVERNMENT UNIT

13 DEBT ACT AND ANY STATEMENTS REQUIRED BY

14 SECTION 8026 OF SUCH DEBT ACT TO QUALIFY THE

15 DEBT INCURRED AS SELF-LIQUIDATING DEBT;

16 AUTHORIZING THE PREPARATION OF A DEBT

17 STATEMENT AND BORROWING BASE CERTIFICATE;

18 SPECIFICALLY APPROVING AMOUNTS OF FIXED RENT

19 AND OTHER PAYMENTS (INCLUDING THE GUARANTY

20 OF DEBT SERVICE ON SAID BONDS) TO BE MADE BY

21 THE CITY UNDER SUCH LEASE; APPROVING AND

22 ACKNOWLEDGING NOTICE OF THE AUTHORITY'S

23 ASSIGNMENT OF SUCH RENTALS TO TRUSTEE IN

24 RESPECT OF THE AUTHORITY'S BONDS;

25 AUTHORIZING INCIDENTAL ACTION; REPEALING
.

35


1 INCONSISTENT PRIOR ORDINANCES; AND APPROVING

2 THE FORM OF, AND AUTHORIZING, SUBJECT TO

3 RECEIPT OF NECESSARY STATE APPROVALS,

4 EXECUTING AND DELIVERY OF THE FIFTH

5 SUPPLEMENTAL LEASE AND THE THIRD OPERATING

6 AGREEMENT.

7 MR. COURTRIGHT: I move that Item

8 5-B pass Reading by Title.

9 MR. MCGOFF: Second.

10 MS. GATELLI: On the question?

11 MR. COURTRIGHT: On the question, we

12 had a lot of questions for Mr. Wintermantle

13 and the people that came in there and I know

14 some of you were in the back room with us,

15 but I think some of the things I asked that

16 other people asked what is that are all of

17 the parking garages able to -- are they

18 generating enough revenue to pay for all

19 their bills and he said they were, asked if

20 the new facilities that they were going to

21 acquire and if that had any people that were

22 already interested in the spaces and most of

23 the spaces were all taken, asked about the

24 Medallion Garage and he said it was paying

25 for itself there was only one retail space I
.

36


1 believe he said wasn't rented out yet and

2 they are hopeful it's somebody else. Asked

3 about what the interest was on it and we are

4 going to go for a lower interest rate from a

5 variable rate to a fixed. I know

6 Mr. Sbaraglia and Ms. Shumaker asked some

7 questions and I just think that when we have

8 legislation like this in the future that

9 maybe if they come in beforehand, and I said

10 this last week, that it would be a good idea

11 to help move things along a little quicker,

12 but I just wanted to share that with you.

13 Thank you.

14 MS. GATELLI: Anyone else on the

15 question?

16 MS. EVANS: Yes. To add to what

17 Mr. Courtright has said, yes,

18 Mr. Wintermantle indicates that the parking

19 authority is in the black currently, but if

20 you take a look at the audit, the

21 independent audit of city council for the

22 Year 2005, but it's classified as the 2006

23 audit, they carry a long-term debt of

24 $31,805,159 without, just setting aside this

25 $35 million project.
.

37


1 In addition, in their current fiscal

2 year 2007 they owe $1,173,528 in principal

3 and interest on bond series from previous

4 years. That does not take into account all

5 of the monthly expenses of the parking

6 authority that would include salaries and

7 health benefits and materials and supplies,

8 etcetera to numerous to mention.

9 As of today's meeting I had not

10 received the most current monthly financial

11 reports of the Scranton Parking Authority,

12 so I had to base my questions and concerns

13 during today's caucus on the financial

14 statements of January and February 2007, and

15 according to those figures the parking

16 authority, the garages, would have been in

17 the red in that they were not earning enough

18 income in order to pay all monthly expenses

19 and the current bond issues. However,

20 Mr. Wintermantle responded that the

21 Medallion Garage recently opened I believe

22 in November 2006 and since it has now been

23 up and running for a period of eight months

24 they are anticipating much greater revenue,

25 but that is an if. There are many if's in
.

38


1 this situation.

2 I also learned that a company who

3 had been very interested in the purchase of

4 the Electric City Garage will not be doing

5 so because this particular bond issue would

6 be unsuccessful without the parking

7 authority retaining ownership of all of it's

8 garages in order to remain financially

9 viable, so that bottom line here, if you

10 were to attempt to sell any of the garages,

11 the Scranton Parking Authority would find

12 itself in a difficult financial straights.

13 I do believe that the Oppenheim Garage

14 is in need of repair, it's a very old

15 garage, however, when questioned about the

16 possibility of renovation rather than

17 demolition and new construction, that had

18 never been discussed, yet Mayor Doherty in

19 2004 stated that when he was in the -- or

20 when the Scranton Parking Authority was

21 taking on a new series of bonds in January

22 2004, 1.5 million worth of that money was

23 going to be set aside for renovation to the

24 Oppenheim Garage. Unfortunately, that

25 didn't occur because the 1.5 million was
.

39


1 needed for the additional costs of the

2 Medallion Garage which is a beautiful,

3 beautiful garage, but if renovation was

4 discussed in 2004 why has renovation not

5 even reached the stage or a discussion of

6 consideration in 2007?

7 I don't believe that the parking

8 authority can so easily assume $35 million

9 worth of the additional debt on top of the

10 32 million they currently possess and, as I

11 said, I do believe the garage has to be

12 addressed, but I would think that perhaps

13 Sanofi-Pasteur who would like to take quite

14 a number of the those spaces might entertain

15 taking ownership of that garage and making

16 the renovations or constructing the new

17 garage at their own cost and then receiving,

18 you know, payments for that from the tenants

19 of that garage. In other words, we are

20 building something here for the employees of

21 Sonafi and the tenants of the Connell

22 building, and far fewer of the spaces are

23 designated for those who work in the City of

24 Scranton and those who shop or do business

25 in the City of Scranton. Now, we can set
.

40


1 that aside, the fact remains this is a

2 tremendous amount of money and you

3 ultimately are responsible for those

4 payments if ever, it hasn't occurred to

5 date, but if ever the parking authority were

6 unable to make those payments and I just

7 don't believe that's a financial burden that

8 the citizens of the city can assume at this

9 point in time. Yes, there should be a

10 garage, but I think these multi-million

11 dollars companies who would like to utilize

12 it are the ones perhaps who should be

13 looking at turning that garage around.

14 MS. GATELLI: Anyone else? All those

15 in favor?

16 MS. FANUCCI: Aye.

17 MR. MCGOFF: Aye.

18 MR. COURTRIGHT: Aye.

19 MS. GATELLI: Aye. Opposed?

20 MS. EVANS: No.

21 MS. GATELLI: The ayes have it and so

22 moved.

23 MS. GARVEY: SIXTH ORDER. 6-A. FOR

24 CONSIDERATION BY THE COMMITTEE ON FINANCE -

25 FOR ADOPTION - FILE OF COUNCIL NO. 101, 2007
.

41


1 - SALE OF TAX DELINQUENT PROPERTY AT 2324

2 PITTSTON AVENUE, SCRANTON, PENNSYLVANIA, TO

3 ROBERT WEBER AND MARY BETH WEBER, HIS WIFE,

4 2309 PITTSTON AVENUE, SCRANTON,

5 PENNSYLVANIA, 18505, FOR THE SUM OF $6,000.

6 MS. GATELLI: What is the

7 recommendation of the Chair on finance?

8 MS. EVANS: As chair for the

9 Committee on Finance, I recommend final

10 passage of Item 6-A.

11 MR. COURTRIGHT: Second.

12 MS. GATELLI: On the question. Roll

13 call.

14 MR. COOLICAN: Mrs. Evans.

15 MRS. EVANS: Yes.

16 MR. COOLICAN: Mrs. Fanucci.

17 MS. FANUCCI: Yes.

18 MR. COOLICAN: Mr. McGoff.

19 MR. MCGOFF: Yes.

20 Mr. COOLICAN: Mr. Courtright.

21 MR. COURTRIGHT: Yes.

22 MR. COOLICAN: Mrs. Gatelli.

23 MS. GATELLI: Yes. I hereby declare

24 6-A legally and lawfully adopted.

25 MS. GARVEY: 6-B. FOR CONSIDERATION
.

42


1 BY THE COMMITTEE ON FINANCE - FOR ADOPTION -

2 FILE OF COUNCIL NO. 102, 2007 - SALE OF TAX

3 DELINQUENT PROPERTY AT 113-115 SOUTH BROMLEY

4 AVENUE, SCRANTON, PENNSYLVANIA, TO JOSEPH A.

5 HAZZOURI, JR., 125 FAIRVIEW AVENUE,

6 SCRANTON, PENNSYLVANIA, 18504, FOR THE SUM

7 OF $4,600.00.

8 MS. GATELLI: What is the

9 recommendation of the Chair on Finance?

10 MS. EVANS: As chair for the

11 Committee on Finance, I recommend final

12 passage of Item 6-B.

13 MR. COURTRIGHT: Second.

14 MS. GATELLI: On the question? Roll

15 call.

16 MR. COOLICAN: Mrs. Evans.

17 MRS. EVANS: Yes.

18 MR. COOLICAN: Mrs. Fanucci.

19 MS. FANUCCI: Yes.

20 MR. COOLICAN: Mr. McGoff.

21 MR. MCGOFF: Yes.

22 Mr. COOLICAN: Mr. Courtright.

23 MR. COURTRIGHT: Yes.

24 MR. COOLICAN: Mrs. Gatelli.

25 MS. GATELLI: Yes. I hereby declare
.

43


1 6-B legally and lawfully adopted.

2 MS. GARVEY: 6-C. FOR CONSIDERATION

3 BY THE COMMITTEE ON RULES - FOR ADOPTION -

4 RESOLUTION NO. 156, 2007 - APPOINTMENT OF

5 JEFFREY BRAZIL, 922 FRONT STREET, SCRANTON,

6 PENNSYLVANIA, 18505, TO THE POSITION OF

7 DIRECTOR OF THE DEPARTMENT OF PUBLIC WORKS,

8 EFFECTIVE JULY 2, 2007. MR. BRAZIL WILL BE

9 REPLACING GEORGE PARKER WHO RESIGNED.

10 MS. GATELLI: As the chairperson for

11 the Committee on Rules, I recommend final

12 passage of 6-C.

13 MR. MCGOFF: Second.

14 MS. GATELLI: On the question?

15 MR. COURTRIGHT: On the question, I'm

16 going to be voting, no, on this, not in the

17 negative that I don't think Mr. Brazil

18 should have the job, I think he will do a

19 fine job, so far he has done terrific with

20 me. I just have a problem with the salary.

21 That's what I'm hung up on. I didn't get

22 any information whether he would be taking

23 on any additional duties. The justification

24 by the administration giving Mr. Parker the

25 salary was that he was going to be the city
.

44


1 engineer and he was going to be the DPW

2 director and Mr. Brazil is not going to be

3 the city engineer and he is also not in

4 charge of traffic maintenance anymore,

5 that's gone over to Mr. Elliott, the police

6 chief. And, again, I think Mr. Brazil will

7 do a fine job as the DPW director I just am

8 voting no because of the salary and I

9 certainly hope he doesn't take this

10 personally. Again, it's nothing against

11 him, it's the salary I disagree with.

12 MS. EVANS: I might add, I raised

13 most of the concerns Mr. Courtright just

14 mentioned at last week's meeting. I asked

15 for a response from the mayor as pertaining

16 to a reduction in salary for each of the

17 three positions on which we are voting

18 today. I received no answer which tells me,

19 in fact, I did receive an answer, there will

20 be no reduction in salary for any of the

21 three positions. And as Mr. Courtright

22 said, I'm sure all three men are going to do

23 a wonderful job. One of them I frankly

24 don't know at all, the other two I do. I

25 know those two to be very hardworking and I
.

45


1 have heard wonderful, wonderful things about

2 the third individual, so I do wish them

3 well, I look forward to working with them,

4 but I do want to go on record as stating

5 that these salaries are inappropriate and do

6 not reflect accurately the duties and

7 responsibilities of the positions nor do

8 they reflect the credentials and

9 experiential backgrounds of any of the

10 appointees, therefore, I will be voting, no,

11 and as Mr. Courtright said, I hope they are

12 not going to hold this against me or against

13 any of you that I am trying to help here

14 because they are fine gentlemen and I'm sure

15 they are going to do a very good job, but as

16 reasonable gentlemen I hope they can

17 understand my point what I'm saying on

18 behalf of the citizens.

19 MS. GARVEY: Anyone else on the

20 question?

21 MR. BOLUS: Madame President, Bob

22 Bolus --

23 MS. GATELLI: Mr. Bolus --

24 MR. BOLUS: If I may, under the

25 Sunshine Act I believe I have the
.

46


1 opportunity to --

2 MR. MCGOFF: Mr. Bolus, you are out

3 of order.

4 MS. GATELLI: Mr. Minora, does anyone

5 have the opportunity to ask the question

6 when we are --

7 MR. MINORA: We are not in the public

8 comment section. There has been opportunity

9 to discuss these last two weeks and you are

10 completely out of order. You are completely

11 out of order.

12 MR. BOLUS: If I got my comment

13 period after you have voted on this, it's a

14 moot point for me.

15 MR. MINORA: Well, if you were here

16 last week would you have had your

17 opportunity, so the opportunity was present

18 and you simply didn't take it and now you

19 wish to take it at a time --

20 MR. BOLUS: Well, I wasn't here.

21 MR. MINORA: -- at a time -- at a

22 time that is totally inappropriate.

23 MR. BOLUS: Mr. Minora --

24 MR. MINORA: At a time that is

25 totally inappropriate. You had your
.

47


1 opportunity, you chose not to take it at the

2 appropriate time and now you are trying to

3 take it at an inappropriate time and you

4 are, therefore, out of order.

5 MR. BOLUS: I totally disagree with

6 you, that's your opinion and we all have our

7 opinion and under the Sunshine Act --

8 MS. FANUCCI: We are going to call

9 for a recess so we can have some decorum in

10 this place. This is not normal.

11 MR. BOLUS: Well, let's finish--

12 MS. FANUCCI: I'd like a recess

13 please. This goes against our rules. You

14 cannot just come in here speaking.

15 MR. MINORA: Out of order.

16 MS. FANUCCI: You can't come in here

17 speaking.

18 MS. GATELLI: I'll second it. All in

19 favor. Aye. We will be recessing for ten

20 minutes.

21 MR. BOLUS: At a public meeting if

22 there is a perceived violation of the

23 Sunshine Act and you have done that.

24 (Recess taken)

25 (After recess the vote was taken on
.

48


1 6-C.)

2 MS. GATELLI: Roll call.

3 MR. COOLICAN: Mrs. Evans.

4 MRS. EVANS: No.

5 MR. COOLICAN: Mrs. Fanucci.

6 MS. FANUCCI: Yes.

7 MR. COOLICAN: Mr. McGoff.

8 MR. MCGOFF: Yes.

9 Mr. COOLICAN: Mr. Courtright.

10 MR. COURTRIGHT: No.

11 MR. COOLICAN: Mrs. Gatelli.

12 MS. GATELLI: Yes. I hereby declare

13 6-C legally and lawfully adopted.

14 MS. GARVEY: 6-D. FOR CONSIDERATION

15 BY THE COMMITTEE ON RULES - FOR ADOPTION -

16 RESOLUTION NO. 157, 2007 - APPOINTMENT OF

17 MARK DOUGHER, 1105 CORNELL STREET, SCRANTON,

18 PENNSYLVANIA, 18504, TO THE POSITION OF

19 DIRECTOR OF PARKS AND RECREATION EFFECTIVE

20 JULY 2, 2007. MR. DOUGHER WILL BE REPLACING

21 JEFFREY BRAZIL, WHO TOOK ANOTHER POSITION

22 WITH THE CITY.

23 MS. GATELLI: As Chair for the

24 Committee on Rules, I recommend final

25 passage of 6-D.
.

49


1 MR. COURTRIGHT: Second.

2 MS. GATELLI: On the question? Roll

3 call.

4 MR. COOLICAN: Mrs. Evans.

5 MRS. EVANS: No.

6 MR. COOLICAN: Mrs. Fanucci.

7 MS. FANUCCI: Yes.

8 MR. COOLICAN: Mr. McGoff.

9 MR. MCGOFF: Yes.

10 Mr. COOLICAN: Mr. Courtright.

11 MR. COURTRIGHT: Yes.

12 MR. COOLICAN: Mrs. Gatelli.

13 MS. GATELLI: Yes. I hereby declare

14 6-D legally and lawfully adopted.

15 MS. GARVEY: 6-E. FOR CONSIDERATION

16 BY THE COMMITTEE ON RULES - FOR ADOPTION -

17 RESOLUTION NO. 158, 2007 - APPOINTMENT OF

18 STUART RENDA, 1112 WOODLAWN STREET,

19 SCRANTON, PENNSYLVANIA, 18509, TO THE

20 POSITION OF DIRECTOR OF LICENSING,

21 INSPECTIONS & PERMITS, EFFECTIVE JULY 2,

22 2007. MR. RENDA WILL BE REPLACING WILLIAM

23 FIORINI, WHO RESIGNED EFFECTIVE JULY 2,

24 2007.

25 MS. GATELLI: As Chair for the
.

50


1 Committee on Rules, I recommend final

2 passage of 6-E.

3 MR. COURTRIGHT: Second.

4 MS. GATELLI: On the question. Roll

5 call.

6 MR. COOLICAN: Mrs. Evans.

7 MRS. EVANS: No.

8 MR. COOLICAN: Mrs. Fanucci.

9 MS. FANUCCI: Yes.

10 MR. COOLICAN: Mr. McGoff.

11 MR. MCGOFF: Yes.

12 Mr. COOLICAN: Mr. Courtright.

13 MR. COURTRIGHT: Yes.

14 MR. COOLICAN: Mrs. Gatelli.

15 MS. GATELLI: Yes. I hereby declare

16 6-E legally and lawfully adopted.

17 THE COURT: 6-F. FOR CONSIDERATION

18 BY THE COMMITTEE ON COMMUNITY DEVELOPMENT -

19 FOR ADOPTION - RESOLUTION NO. 159, 2007

20 AUTHORIZING THE MAYOR AND OTHER APPROPRIATE

21 OFFICIALS FOR THE CITY OF SCRANTON TO ENTER

22 INTO A LOAN AGREEMENT AND MAKE A LOAN FROM

23 THE COMMERCIAL INDUSTRIAL LOAN PROGRAM,

24 PROJECT NO. 150.11 IN AN AMOUNT NOT TO

25 EXCEED $65,000.00 TO PAUL M. NARDONE D/B/A
.

51


1 OUTRAGEOUS TO ASSIST AN ELIGIBLE PROJECT.

2 MS. GATELLI: What is the

3 recommendation of the Chair on Community

4 Development?

5 MS. FANUCCI: As chairperson for the

6 Committee on Community Development, I

7 recommend final passage of Item 6-F.

8 MR. COURTRIGHT: Second.

9 MS. GATELLI: On the question. Roll

10 call.

11 MR. COOLICAN: Mrs. Evans.

12 MRS. EVANS: Yes.

13 MR. COOLICAN: Mrs. Fanucci.

14 MS. FANUCCI: Yes.

15 MR. COOLICAN: Mr. McGoff.

16 MR. MCGOFF: Yes.

17 Mr. COOLICAN: Mr. Courtright.

18 MR. COURTRIGHT: Yes.

19 MR. COOLICAN: Mrs. Gatelli.

20 MS. GATELLI: Yes. I hereby declare

21 6-F legally and lawfully adopted.

22 MS. GARVEY: 6-G FOR CONSIDERATION BY

23 THE COMMITTEE ON COMMUNITY DEVELOPMENT - FOR

24 ADOPTION - RESOLUTION NO. 160, 2007 -

25 AUTHORIZING THE MAYOR AND OTHER APPROPRIATE
.

52


1 CITY OFFICIALS FOR THE CITY OF SCRANTON TO

2 ENTER INTO A LOAN AGREEMENT AND MAKE A LOAN

3 FROM THE URBAN DEVELOPMENT ACTION GRANT

4 REPAYMENT LOAN PROGRAM, PROJECT NO. 400.33

5 IN AN AMOUNT NOT TO EXCEED $85,000.00 TO

6 PATRICIA E. PETROZIELLO D/B/A AROMA CAFE TO

7 ASSIST IN ELIGIBLE PROJECT.

8 MS. GATELLI: What is the

9 recommendation of the Chair on Community

10 Development?

11 MS. FANUCCI: As chairperson for the

12 Committee on Community Development, I

13 recommend final passage of item 6-G.

14 MR. COURTRIGHT: Second.

15 MS. GATELLI: On the question? Roll

16 call.

17 MR. COOLICAN: Mrs. Evans.

18 MRS. EVANS: Yes.

19 MR. COOLICAN: Mrs. Fanucci.

20 MS. FANUCCI: Yes.

21 MR. COOLICAN: Mr. McGoff.

22 MR. MCGOFF: Yes.

23 Mr. COOLICAN: Mr. Courtright.

24 MR. COURTRIGHT: No.

25 MR. COOLICAN: Mrs. Gatelli.
.

53


1 MS. GATELLI: Yes. I hereby declare

2 6-G legally and lawfully adopted.

3 MS. EVANS: Kay, before you read the

4 next item I would like to a make a motion to

5 table 6-H until next week. Mr. Barrett was

6 kind enough to send along the operating

7 budgets for all of the years I requested,

8 however, I didn't receive these until

9 yesterday and I haven't been able to get

10 through all of them and if council wishes to

11 indulge me I would do that between now and

12 next week or if not then we'll just move

13 today, but that was a motion to table.

14 MR. COURTRIGHT: I'll second that.

15 MS. GATELLI: On the question? We'll

16 do a roll call on this, Neil.

17 MS. FANUCCI: It was a motion to

18 table. We have a second.

19 MS. GATELLI: All in favor.

20 MS. EVANS: Aye.

21 MS. FANUCCI: Aye.

22 MR. MCGOFF: Aye.

23 MR. COURTRIGHT: Aye.

24 MS. GATELLI: Aye. The ayes have it

25 and so moved.
.

54


1 MS. GARVEY: SEVENTH ORDER. CITIZENS

2 PARTICIPATION.

3 MS. GATELLI: Doug Miller.

4 MR. MILLER: Good afternoon, Council,

5 Doug Miller. I'd just like to read again

6 the list of the contributors for the

7 handicapped swingset project. For those who

8 were unable to attend or couldn't view the

9 meeting last week I would like to thank all

10 of those that purchased raffle tickets that

11 we sold at last year's Italian festival.

12 I'd like to thank the Kiwanas Club, Cecco

13 Associates, the Arc of Northeastern

14 Pennsylvania. Miss Noel Adcroft, School Nut

15 heads fundraiser. Mr. Wayne Evans, John J.

16 Ryan Insurance, Mrs. Diane Runchack, CMC

17 Health Care Systems, Tour D'Scranton,

18 Michael Burke Plumbing, Miller Bean Funeral

19 Home, Albert A. Hazzouri, Junior, Mr. Jack

20 Lions, Texcalb. Mr. Gardenevitch, Gerrity's

21 Supermarket, Mr. David Evans, the McKeean

22 family and Mrs. Victoria McDonald. We

23 appreciate your support for the handicap.

24 Without your support and contributions we

25 would have achieved our goal and we look
.

55


1 forward to installing the swingset fairly

2 soon. Thank you.

3 MS. GATELLI: Thank you, Mr. Miller.

4 Mrs. Franas.

5 MS. FRANAS: Fay Franas. I'd like to

6 start off by asking you something,

7 Mr. Courtright, but I would appreciate if

8 you would answer it at the end so I would

9 have more time. Mr. Courtright, you have

10 been a wonderful councilperson for all of

11 the people in Scranton for as long as the

12 term has served and now you are running for

13 election again for four years and you have

14 really been there for the people. Sadly,

15 I'd just like to know this because I have

16 been looking on this website for this last

17 night since there was a rumor that quite

18 possibly that if Mr. Kenny McDowell got the

19 county controller's job that you would be

20 taking over as tax collector. I would hope

21 that wouldn't be true because we really need

22 you here. If you could just say one way or

23 the other if that's quite possibly true, I

24 would appreciate it. That's all. I want to

25 get finished speaking.
.

56


1 Okay, Mrs. Gatelli, I'd like to ask

2 you a couple of questions, please. May I

3 ask you, how do you determine what's out of

4 order and what isn't? I'd like you to

5 clearly and concisely define out of order

6 for myself and the many people that come

7 here to address council so we would know

8 what would be out of order and what wouldn't

9 be.

10 MR. GATELLI: Would you like me to do

11 that now?

12 MS. FRANAS: Yes, if it's not going

13 to be long, I guess, yes.

14 MS. GATELLI: No, it's just basically

15 one paragraph that of the rules that were

16 adopted by all of this council: No person

17 shall address council for more than five

18 minutes unless extended by the council

19 president. The five-minute time limit

20 includes any time that council may speak in

21 response to the person's question or

22 comment. All comments shall be directed to

23 the council president. No person shall use

24 his or her time during citizen's

25 participation to personally insult or attack
.

57


1 any individual. Personal insults, attacks,

2 name calling and other behavior that is

3 inconsistent with the purpose and intent of

4 conducting official business shall not be

5 permitted nor tolerated.

6 The council president in his or her

7 sole discretion shall determine if and when

8 any person violates this section. Any

9 person violating this section shall be ruled

10 out of order by the council president and

11 any immediately removed from the meeting at

12 the council president's request.

13 MS. FRANAS: May I just add that --

14 what book is that from, your rules, is that

15 written somewhere?

16 MS. GATELLI: Yes, I have a Copy.

17 MS. FRANAS: What book is that, your

18 own council set of rules?

19 MS. GATELLI: Our rules that we vote

20 on.

21 MS. FRANAS: Okay. I also would

22 want to say that I don't believe, Mrs.

23 President that those rules supercede the

24 constitution of the United States. As I

25 read the constitution there is no where in
.

58


1 there that it says a mention of out of order

2 and stop the people's freedom of speech and

3 I would like to know what you consider free

4 speech? I mean, you say things are, I

5 believe, in my own opinion that when someone

6 says something you don't like they are ought

7 of order, but when somebody says something

8 that you like they can talk over the five

9 minutes, it's happened, not intentionally

10 but it has happened.

11 MS. GATELLI: I'm sorry that you

12 feel that way.

13 MS. FRANAS: And I'd also like to

14 ask you what you consider to be free speech.

15 MS. GATELLI: I would have -- could

16 you please be quite in the audience and

17 respect the speaker at the podium.

18 MS. FRANAS: Go ahead.

19 MS. GATELLI: I would have to defer

20 to Attorney Minora to determine what is free

21 speech and what is according to our rules.

22 MS. FRANAS: Well, I beg to differ,

23 but I really wouldn't want to take his

24 advise. I just couldn't, you are the

25 president, you set the rules.
.

59


1 MS. GATELLI: Well, these are our

2 rules and these are what we go by.

3 MS. FRANAS: Okay.

4 MS. GATELLI: It's been adopted by

5 all of council.

6 MS. FRANAS: Okay. I also would

7 like to ask about Jeff Brazil. I think you

8 should be recuse yourself from voting there.

9 Wasn't Joe Brazil your campaign manager?

10 MS. GATELLI: Yes, I did state that

11 last week.

12 MS. FRANAS: Yeah. But, don't you

13 think it's a conflict of interest? Don't

14 you think you should not vote on this issue.

15 MS. GATELLI: I don't think so

16 because I think he is qualified for the

17 position.

18 MS. FRANAS: There's a conflict

19 there, but let me get back, I'm sorry, I

20 missed one thing. I sort of think there is

21 a little bit of hypocrisy, Mrs. Gatelli.

22 When I was called out of order last week

23 when I allegedly claimed there was some

24 deals being made here, there is a bit of

25 hypocrisy because yourself and Mrs. Fanucci
.

60


1 accused Mr. Pilchesky and Mrs. Evans of

2 corroborating to commit a criminal act and

3 yet there has been no proof, there has been

4 no arrest, there has been no investigation,

5 but yet you sit there and you claim this

6 stuff, so here you are telling me I don't

7 have a right to say something, but, yet, you

8 have come forward and said all of these

9 claims and nothing has ever been done about

10 it. I just wondered why are all of these

11 statements been made if there has been never

12 been an arrest and I just think it's a

13 disgrace.

14 Another thing, last week you

15 mentioned, well, maybe you can answer that,

16 how come there has been no arrest? How come

17 there have been no charges?

18 MS. GATELLI: I'm not sure what all

19 is involved there, Mrs. Franas.

20 MS. FRANAS: Well, the accusations

21 that you made, how come you never followed

22 through with an arrest or any other kind of

23 criminal actions towards the people that you

24 were claiming criminally assaulting you --

25 excuse me, criminally making claims against
.

61


1 you.

2 MS. GATELLI: Mrs. Fanucci would like

3 to address that.

4 MS. FANUCCI: I can tell you that

5 there was never done in a meeting.

6 MS. FRANAS: No, it wasn't.

7 MS. FANUCCI: Right. It was

8 definitely not done in an open public forum.

9 It was not done to go against any rules.

10 MS. FRANAS: No.

11 MS. FANUCCI: Right. So actually

12 this conversation that we are having now has

13 nothing to do with city business.

14 MS. GATELLI: Thank you, Mrs. Franas.

15 The next speaker is Bob Bolus.

16 MS. FRANAS: Yes, it does, Mrs.

17 Fanucci.

18 MR. COURTRIGHT: Can I answer her

19 question?

20 MS. GATELLI: I'd rather you wouldn't

21 because there is allegations that people can

22 talk --

23 MR. COURTRIGHT: Not about that. She

24 asked me --

25 MS. FRANAS: I asked him a question.
.

62


1 MS. GATELLI: If you can answer it

2 quickly.

3 MR. COURTRIGHT: I'll do it as

4 quickly as possible.

5 MS. FRANAS: Bill, you don't have to

6 answer it quickly, you can take as long as

7 you want, you are a council person.

8 MR. COURTRIGHT: All right.

9 MS. FRANAS: Nobody can tell you how

10 long to speak.

11 MR. COURTRIGHT: You know, I am

12 actually glad that she asked me because

13 there has been three different rumors that

14 have been asked of me and my family: Number

15 one was the mayor is going to retire and

16 this council is going to appoint me mayor

17 for the rest of his term. The other one was

18 that Mr. Szymanski is going to retire from

19 the sherif and I'm going to get appointed to

20 his position; and the third is that

21 Mr. McDowell is going to leave and I'm going

22 to appointed to his position. No one has

23 ever offered me any of those three

24 positions, so I don't, you know, I don't

25 know where that came from. I'm glad that
.

63


1 they think I'm qualified for these three

2 positions, that's nice, but in all honesty,

3 all kidding aside, nobody has ever asked me

4 any of those three and I just don't know

5 where that came from.

6 MS. GATELLI: Mr. Bolus?

7 MR. BOLUS: Sister Adrian signed next

8 to me and I'd like to let her go ahead of me

9 if that's possible and then I'll follow her.

10 MS. GATELLI: Sure. That's fine.

11 MR. BOLUS: Thank you.

12 MS. GATELLI: Sister.

13 MS. BARRETT: Thank you, Mrs.

14 Gatelli, and members of council, I'm

15 delighted to be here and I'm here to give a

16 bit of gratitude. Yesterday was a very

17 special day for the Friends of the Poor.

18 They had a wonderful swim in Nay Aug Park

19 and they used the water slide and this was

20 sponsored by the Scranton Taxpayers and

21 Citizens Association and I'm here to express

22 gratitude to them and they collected money

23 through special events and they went to

24 businesses and private individuals and I

25 noticed in the newspaper they had had
.

64


1 sponsored two free swims at the park for

2 kids who wouldn't be able to go. This was a

3 big concern to me and I was delighted to

4 read that so I called council just about a

5 couple of days ago and I very kindly spoke

6 to the clerk who, thank you, to call one of

7 the members and gave me the name and so

8 forth and I got an immediate response.

9 I want to thank Ozzie Quinn and Andy

10 Sbaraglia right here, over here, and Bill

11 Jackowitz, these were the gentlemen that I

12 was in touch with and it was an immediate

13 response and I just have to say that the

14 business community and to the individuals

15 that donated thank you, but also thank you

16 to this group, the taxpayers and citizens

17 association, for taking the initiative and

18 providing a swim for kids that wouldn't get

19 to the parks and they were so happy. We had

20 the whole day there and, of course, God was

21 very good with the weather. Thank goodness

22 it wasn't today and it was just a perfect

23 day to swim.

24 I also want to -- I'm very happy to

25 see city council did not charge a fee for
.

65


1 the other pools. I noticed that the kids

2 are using them every chance they get. I'm

3 over right near St. Lucy's now and through

4 the grass everyday there is a whole group of

5 kids running up with their trunks to

6 Novembrino pool and enjoying it and now the

7 lunch program has a hot lunch for the kids

8 there, that's so important. So these are

9 some good things that are happening and I'm

10 very grateful to you, Andy, who came by

11 yesterday and saw the children and helped

12 with the count and so forth and I want to

13 thank your group and the individuals I

14 mentioned and all of the taxpayers group and

15 also commend the businesses and corporations

16 and individuals who so kindly did this for

17 the children of the community, especially

18 children who would not be able to get there,

19 and they have the same desires and wishes

20 and hopes that every other kid has, but the

21 possibility of their seeing those things

22 happen to them very often is limited because

23 of the economic conditions and poverty and

24 the tragedy of poverty and what goes with.

25 I don't think want to take anymore time, but
.

66


1 I say thank you to you and have a good day.

2 Glad to be here.

3 MS. GATELLI: Thank you.

4 MR. BOLUS: Afternoon, Council, Bob

5 Bolus. On a different note, I'd still like

6 to voice my objection as I did earlier under

7 the Sunshine Act regarding 6-C,D, C and D I

8 guess and 6-E under the Sunshine Act that

9 you didn't let me finish earlier, 65 DS 281,

10 Sunshine Act Section 10.1 which allows

11 anyone who has an objection at any time

12 during the public meeting, if they have a

13 belief that there is a perceived violation

14 of the Sunshine Act they have a right to

15 speak out and I did so and I want that as a

16 matter of record that I was not allowed to

17 voice my opinion. There is nothing that

18 says that I can't speak and come here and

19 vote. I'm not a paid employee of the city,

20 I'm a taxpayer and I believe my rights were

21 violated. I also believe the rights of

22 Mr. Quinn last week were violated as well.

23 Having said that, I'll move on. The

24 reason I'm here today most importantly is

25 that you are going to at some point have a
.

67


1 committee to figure out your next budget. I

2 raised it more than once here. I believe

3 you all know my reasoning for coming here

4 regarding the golf course money, that three

5 million was originally proposed by

6 Mrs. Evans and then it was changed to 1.5

7 million by Mr. McGoff. The intent of this

8 money from all of the minutes was to be put

9 in trust and the interest used for parks and

10 recreation. I believe that was the total

11 violation that this council committed. You

12 had no right to that money and neither did

13 the mayor. You still have $1.5 million

14 sitting somewhere. It's my request today

15 that the this council make a motion to put

16 that money in trust, permanent trust, find

17 out where the interest is and also return in

18 your next budget the $1.5 million that you

19 had no right to vote upon and take from the

20 people in the future generations of these

21 kids the parks and recreation that this

22 money, the interest would have went to, to

23 be replaced fully with the interest that

24 should have accrued on it. If that money

25 was placed in a proper trust and invested
.

68


1 properly it would earning somewhere around

2 $300,000 a year plus right now, and you

3 cannot sit here as a council and squander

4 this money just to satisfy the whims of the

5 mayor or whether he could balance a budget

6 or you have to balance it. That's what

7 erasers were for. You are all educators,

8 anyway in the most part, and you know how to

9 use a eraser and that's what you should have

10 did to the budget. If he needed 1.5 million

11 dollars then you should have took it out of

12 his budget and let him figure out how to do

13 it instead of just squandering.

14 You mentioned the garage earlier,

15 somebody else bought it, Aventure Pasture,

16 or whoever, is that a K O Z project or a KOZ

17 in the city or would they being paying taxes

18 if they brought that parking garage? Okay.

19 The next thing is the kids, I call them

20 the kids, the Junior Council, which is

21 another disappointment on my part with

22 council. When these ten kids came here two

23 each were to go with each member of council

24 to learn and be educated by council and at

25 no time were they ever brought with the
.

69


1 council to rotate throughout the year, and I

2 think that's a shame on the council that you

3 guys didn't give these kids the opportunity

4 they came here for and a lot of them left

5 because they were disappointed and bored, so

6 I think you need to reevaluate your position

7 as educators to educate these kids. These

8 children, as we want to call them, are the

9 future leaders. I went with them yesterday

10 to Weston Park and I have been backing them

11 100 percent and I was disappointed no

12 council members showed up at the meeting at

13 Weston Park yesterday over the handicapped

14 swingset that they went out, they secured

15 the money from donations, over $4,000, to

16 put in across from the handicapped treehouse

17 up in Nay Aug. Well, we met with the

18 recreation authority, Mr. Maranucci,

19 Mr. Brazil and Mr. Dougher yesterday and

20 they were rejected from putting that at that

21 site. They want to put it at another site.

22 Well, the decision is to the kids who raised

23 this money. It's their project, but they

24 need the support of this council and it's

25 not there and I'm disappointed in that.
.

70


1 Well, they have a week to decide where

2 they are going to put the swingset. They

3 want to put it in some other parr of the

4 park that will be a handicapped park in the

5 future. I believe this council has to get

6 in this because the decision that they will

7 make that if doesn't go by the swing, the

8 swingset doesn't go by the treehouse they

9 are going to return the funds back into the

10 people that donated it.

11 MS. GATELLI: Okay, thank you.

12 MR. BOLUS: And that's a slap in the

13 face to the city for the people that did it

14 and I think you should all have been

15 involved. Thank you.

16 MS. GATELLI: Thank you, Mr. Bolus.

17 MS. EVANS: Mrs. Gatelli, I just

18 wanted to make a statement regarding the

19 golf course monies to clear this up once and

20 for all. The mayor after the sale of the

21 municipal golf course suggested that the

22 proceeds of that sale be placed in a trust

23 for the future maintenance of Nay Aug Park

24 and possibly the other city parks. That has

25 never occurred. For my first three years on
.

71


1 council I think we could say badgered the

2 mayor, particularly at budget time, to do

3 just what he had envisioned, but I was met

4 each year with the response that, no, it was

5 not in a trust, it was not going in a trust,

6 it was in CD's, it was collecting very

7 little interest, that's how you were

8 informed of that by me.

9 Now, it still remains in a CD

10 collecting interest, 1.5 million of it that

11 is. My opinion was after waiting all these

12 years following the sale of that golf course

13 for those monies to be placed in trust this

14 was never going to happen, hence, you have

15 $3 million available to this mayor for any

16 project or purpose he deems necessary. That

17 to me was not the ideal situation. I

18 believed that that money should be used to

19 help the taxpayers of this city and I think

20 if we conducted a survey of the people of

21 Scranton and asked, "Would you like the

22 $3 million to stay in the bank accessible to

23 the mayor for his projects or would you like

24 this $3 million used to prevent a tax

25 increase or decrease your taxes," I'm fairly
.

72


1 certain they would like the money used and

2 that's why the money was put in my budget.

3 Now, the mayor in which it eventually

4 was used was to offset a reality transfer

5 tax. I did not vote to approve that because

6 I felt that was an improper use of this

7 money, but the money should be used to

8 prevent tax increases on these people

9 because you know and I know very well what

10 this administration's tendencies can be like

11 towards spending money, and, frankly, it's

12 astounding it's remained that long, but the

13 mere fact this it's never been placed in the

14 trust --

15 MR. BOLUS: If I may, Mrs. Evans --

16 MS. EVANS: -- despite the constant

17 insistence --

18 MS. GATELLI: No, she can talk, but

19 your time is up, Mr. Bolus.

20 MS. EVANS: The constant insistence

21 of myself and others on council that this be

22 done speaks for itself just as there has

23 been no response to a decrease in salaries

24 for the appointees that came before us

25 legislatively today, that failure to respond
.

73


1 and that placement as CD's roll over, that

2 continual placement into CD's of that money

3 speak for itself that he does not intend to

4 place that into a trust, so I feel it's

5 imperative that council use that money

6 wisely before that money winds up being

7 flushed down the toilet.

8 Now, as for the junior council, I

9 did tell Doug Miller last week why I was

10 unable to attend the meeting and I explained

11 that earlier. I have been volunteering at

12 St. Ann's or I would have been there because

13 I do believe, you know, that the location

14 that they had envisioned was the proper

15 location. I support them on that, but as

16 for the education of the council members I

17 think they have done wonderful things, but I

18 have to tell you, on the other hand, some of

19 the education that they get watching this

20 council isn't the type of education I would

21 like them to receive. I don't think they

22 need to know at a very young age the

23 machination that can go on with adults and

24 politics and they are better kept from that.

25 MS. GATELLI: Thank you.
.

74


1 Mr. Sbaraglia.

2 MS. BOLUS: May I just -- excuse me,

3 may I just --

4 MS. GATELLI: No. Mr. Bolus.

5 MR. BOLUS: Because I'd like to--

6 MS. GATELLI: Mr. Bolus, you are out

7 of order.

8 MR. BOLUS: First of all,

9 Mr. Pilchesky told me --

10 MS. GATELLI: Mr. Bolus, you are out

11 of order.

12 MR. BOLUS: -- where the money was

13 and the golf course money was put into

14 trust.

15 MS. GATELLI: Mr. Bolus, you are out

16 of order.

17 MR. BOLUS: Well, I think it's wrong

18 that I can't respond to the question.

19 MS. GATELLI: No, because you are

20 getting more time than anyone else had.

21 Andy Sbaraglia. And, please, if you ask a

22 council member a question and they respond,

23 Council, please wait until they sit down

24 before you answer because I'm getting a lot

25 of complaints that people are engaged at the
.

75


1 podium and they are there for 10,

2 20 minutes, and others are only allowed five

3 minutes, so, Council will refrain from

4 answering until the person is seated,

5 please. It will help. Thank you,

6 Mr. Sbaraglia, I'm sorry.

7 MR. SBARAGALIA: Andy Sbaraglia,

8 citizen of Scranton, fellow Scrantonians, a

9 few words on this acquisition of the parking

10 facilities. I got before me the

11 amortization chart for what we are going to

12 pay for this $35 million loan. We are going

13 to borrow 35 million and we are going to pay

14 back 74,103,455, about two and a half times

15 more -- no, about 2 and 3 quarter times more

16 than we're borrowing. That's what we are

17 going to pay for this garage, but the

18 problem is this is at 7 percent. We got a

19 seven -- what percentage are we paying on

20 the original bond issue?

21 MS. EVANS: We were told 5 percent.

22 MR. SBARAGLIA: Now why would you

23 let somebody transfer 5 percent and then pay

24 7 percent?

25 MS. EVANS: Well, we were told today
.

76


1 that actually it's closer to 4.7 percent at

2 a fixed rate.

3 MR. SBARAGLIA: Well, your

4 amortization chart doesn't say that, it says

5 seven.

6 MS. EVANS: I agree with you. It's a

7 discrepancy.

8 MR. COURTRIGHT: I asked that

9 question, Andy, and you were there, I asked

10 him. He said 4.7 fixed.

11 MR. SBARAGLIA: Yeah, but

12 unfortunately that isn't what your

13 amortization chart says, it says seven. Of

14 course, it isn't -- the loan isn't taken out

15 yet, so they may be correct, but they may

16 not be correct and that's a problem and, of

17 course, you know we are spending a million

18 dollars for a double A rating, but other

19 than -- we are spending a million dollars

20 for the bonding company to take over the

21 debt in case we foreclose, that's the whole

22 thing. That double rating means nothing.

23 God knows what the rating would be even with

24 the parking authority without the bond, it

25 may be b-minus like the city, we don't know.
.

77


1 But the question is there is a lot of things

2 that we do know. We know that the parking

3 authority hasn't set aside any of their

4 income for repair of the garages us because

5 they keep having to borrow to do them. That

6 should tell you that they are skating on

7 very thin ice and if, God forbid, anything

8 ever happened to one of these garages or

9 they get caught in a big lawsuit they won't

10 make it. Of course, their insurance company

11 should cover it I hope, but anyway, that's

12 it. You are skating on thin ice with the

13 parking authority and, like I say, I'm not a

14 concrete man. If they are going to look at

15 a garage, an engineer comes in and looks at

16 the garage and says it's feasible to fix it,

17 it costs such and such amount, but like I

18 said last week, he did make one remark that

19 I made a remark on, the number of cars that

20 can be fit in that garage it went from I

21 want to say from 250 up to three something.

22 Now, there is another problem, what

23 kind of a commitment did we get from

24 Pasteur? I think they are in a KO building,

25 Pasteur is, not the garage, but I believe
.

78


1 they are in a KOZ. That KOZ probably runs

2 out in '11 I think, how long is there

3 commitment to this garage? Did anybody ask

4 them how long is their commitment? Is that

5 a ten-year commitment they are willing to go

6 with or a 15-year commitment or a two-year

7 commitment at three years to when the KOZ

8 let's out. That means a lot. The

9 commitments that they are making has to be

10 in writing and a bank would want that. If

11 they went out and actually on their own, if

12 you were in the commercial business and you

13 went out you're signed leases means a lot

14 for collateral. Well, enough on that.

15 Now, that amoral act is going to

16 come up again, and I call it amoral, that

17 poor delinquent taxes. You never -- if you

18 read that thing they never split in. If you

19 own a lot in the city you could be charged

20 penalty on that lot the same as you would on

21 nine lot and the house. There is no

22 differential in it and that's bad. I mean,

23 your taxes could be -- that penalty is

24 really -- I don't think it's going to hold

25 up in federal court really. I don't think
.

79


1 it can hold up at all. It's oppressive.

2 It's so oppressive that I think the federal

3 courts would actually throw it out. You

4 can't expect somebody to pay a $2,500 fine

5 on a $400 tax or $250 tax. I thank you.

6 MS. GATELLI: Thank you,

7 Mr. Sbaraglia. Mr. Quinn?

8 MR. QUINN: Ozzie Quinn, president of

9 Scranton Lackawanna County Taxpayers and

10 Citizens Association, Incorporated.

11 Mr. Courtright, you mentioned about the West

12 Scranton Club revitalization, I guess that

13 story in the paper this morning sort of gave

14 people a little hope there like a Christmas

15 tree wish list, okay? I did talk to the

16 secretary of budgeting and they said it was

17 a political story and political propaganda

18 that that there is literally thousands of

19 programs across the state on that so there

20 is no basis for that story, it wasn't

21 anything that was concrete and I'm sorry

22 that we have to do that in this city and one

23 town newspaper.

24 MR. COURTRIGHT: I hope that is not

25 the case.
.

80


1 MR. QUINN: What?

2 MS. GATELLI: We have advocates of

3 Mr. Shimkus and Mr. Smith.

4 MR. QUINN: Pardon me, I didn't hear

5 that? Hold what you said after I'm finished

6 you can comment.

7 MS. GATELLI: Okay.

8 MR. QUINN: Okay. Don't take that

9 time away from me, please. Also, I want to

10 mention, I asked last week, Mr. Courtright,

11 you follow-up from my request of your

12 previous meeting that you said if I had

13 anything or anybody had anything regarding

14 that Daron Northeast Industries and I

15 pointed out and I gave you the handouts

16 about the unclarification of that zoning law

17 and that two administrative people made the

18 decision arbitrarily not send that to the

19 planning commission or the zoning board and

20 there was no motion to send it to the Court

21 or you did send a letter, those people poor

22 people go on.

23 MR. COURTRIGHT: I didn't --

24 MR. QUINN: Don't answer, please.

25 Answer after, please.
.

81


1 MR. COURTRIGHT: Okay.

2 MR. QUINN: Miss Fanucci, last week

3 I asked the board if they knew anything, Jim

4 Kiesling and Casey Realty and you didn't say

5 anything, you just sat there, so I do want

6 to ask you, after you can replay to this or

7 not, okay, you know, is anyone in your

8 immediate family related to Casey Realty,

9 James Keisling. No, you can answer after,

10 okay.

11 Okay, I just want to move onto what

12 Mrs. Evans said about the people losing

13 their homes and everything, okay? Years

14 two, three, four, five and six, Scranton

15 received 19 million total 723,000 CDBG

16 funding. 2005, they spent 100,000 only of

17 that 19 million for emergency housing, no

18 rehab, not with any CDBG funds, using a

19 four-year period neighborhood rehab would

20 was only 100 thousands funds for emergency

21 housing. Scranton Annual HUD Home Program

22 minus additional deductions, such as

23 personnel, I don't know if you realize it,

24 they get a percentage of the HOME money for

25 personnel, also, besides the CDBG, they are
.

82


1 not aware, and they received $486,000 or

2 extrapolated over the four years is

3 1,944,000 combined with the Scranton CDBG in

4 home program funds for the past four years

5 indicates that Scranton received from HUD or

6 the CDBG and HOME $21,660,000 approximately

7 around that. According to the OECD per the

8 taxpayers June 9, 2000, letter to HUD, the

9 OECD expended, now, get this here for four

10 years, and this came from OECD because HUD

11 gave them a directive and I received that

12 last week, $915,000 on housing, but only

13 430,000 was expended for rehab of single

14 individual homes in the neighborhood or

15 1.98 percent of the total $21,666,000 that

16 the city received. Can you imagine that?

17 1.98 percent. This is a disaster. This is

18 not a disaster waiting to happen. This is a

19 diaster occurring right now in our

20 neighborhoods I think that situation about

21 revitalization and whatnot it's not

22 happening and I don't know where it's going

23 in South Scranton, but, hey, he said that

24 about a year and a half ago.

25 Our tax base is being demolished,
.

83


1 and this is because there is no

2 rehabilitation in these neighborhoods.

3 There is no concentrated rehabilitation

4 where they would work house to house to

5 house. They don't have the staff. They

6 contract it out and they contract it out to

7 a good service, but that service doesn't

8 have enough staff so we are the ones that

9 are suffering and without the property tax

10 we are not going to able to pay off that as

11 Mrs. Evans says, that Doherty debt of

12 $300 million. We are not going to get

13 enough revenue so we got to face it. We got

14 to start fixing up our homes or people are

15 leaving and these are homes are being

16 demolished.

17 To consolidate a plan, as written by

18 OECD states two to three goals were -- may I

19 finish, for housing in the neighborhood

20 revitalization, not happening. On July 17,

21 2007, I addressed the addition again to HUD

22 via letter. My sources are OECD July 6,

23 2007, letter and HUD CDBG performance

24 programs which I got online. Thank you very

25 much.
.

84


1 MS. GATELLI: Thank you. Nancy

2 Krake.

3 MR. QUINN: I'd like to hear you from

4 you on this question.

5 MS. FANUCCI: Yes. After last week I

6 did check, I have a third cousin that is

7 married to someone from there.

8 MR. QUINN: Thank you.

9 MS. FANUCCI: You are welcome.

10 MR. COURTRIGHT: And I guess I better

11 answer my question. Ozz, when we were in

12 the meeting, I believe Mr. Butler was an

13 attorney there for Mr. Wallace zoning, and I

14 believe Mr. Minora's brother was there on

15 that day and they both felt, and they are

16 attorneys and I'm not, that it was all right

17 what they did. You are asking me to go to

18 Court, and I can't talk to you, I'm not

19 allowed to do that, but you are asking me to

20 go to Court and fight that. I don't how I'd

21 do that, I'm not an attorney and I'm not

22 being told by their attorney and by it was

23 Mr. Minora's brother that it was done

24 properly, and you disagree, I understand

25 that, but I just don't know what it is that
.

85


1 I could do for you there. Sorry.

2 MS. GATELLI: Nancy Krake.

3 MR. COURTRIGHT: You want me to file

4 a suit, I don't --

5 MS. GATELLI: Nancy, come up on.

6 MR. QUINN: You were going to comment

7 on something I said.

8 MS. GATELLI: I don't remember. Mrs.

9 Krake. So funny, aren't they? No respect

10 for anybody.

11 MS. KRAKE: Good afternoon, Council.

12 I'd like to say that I am in exact agreement

13 with everything that Mr. Quinn has to say.

14 I have worked with him over the years and he

15 has a heart for the people. Things that he

16 brings to this podium are not about himself,

17 they are about people who maybe don't have a

18 voice in the city and he doesn't get

19 anything out of it except to do the right

20 thing. One thing that he and I also agree

21 on is that if you would like to collect

22 these delinquent taxes you should get rid of

23 the ordinance that you passed that was

24 passed by Mrs. Fanucci, Mrs. Gatelli and Mr.

25 McGoff, that enforces extremely devastating
.

86


1 and oppressive fines and fees on people who

2 are already not able to pay their taxes.

3 Amnesty will bring the taxes in and you will

4 not need those fines and fees and any one of

5 these three people that voted for it can now

6 bring this up again and it could be gotten

7 rid off or amended to the extreme amended.

8 MS. GATELLI: Mrs. Krake, I just have

9 a question for you, and don't take this off

10 her time, please, if you did an amnesty

11 could you do it for a short period of time

12 and see what came in?

13 MS. KRAKE: Yes. Yes. You as a

14 legislative body you can --

15 MS. GATELLI: Like a month or two.

16 MS. KRAKE: You could absolutely do

17 that. In fact, you will recall we did that

18 -- or the sewer authority used to do it

19 regularly, I don't see why you wouldn't be

20 able to.

21 MS. GATELLI: Has the city ever done

22 an amnesty?

23 MS. KRAKE: We had the garbage

24 amnesty tea at one time.

25 MS. GATELLI: I mean for property
.

87


1 taxes.

2 MS. KRAKE: Not to my recollection.

3 MS. GATELLI: Nobody had a tax sale

4 under Connors, but I don't believe we ever

5 had a --

6 MS. KRAKE: Not to my recollection,

7 but they may have that it's something that

8 I'm just not aware of.

9 MS. GATELLI: Thank you.

10 MS. KRAKE: I think that would be the

11 fairest way, especially since we are in the

12 process of doing the tax sales again using

13 Burheimer to update our records and bring

14 that back to the treasurer's office. I

15 don't know why we have to hurt people like

16 this. Nothing has been done to collect the

17 delinquent wage and mercantile tax for the

18 past three years. How can the onus be on

19 real estate? It makes no sense. Most of

20 these people who this would affect aren't

21 even working. Where would they get these

22 monies from unless somebody wants to take

23 their homes. Taxes should be collected

24 fairly for all people and fairly collected,

25 all types of taxes should be collected
.

88


1 fairly.

2 I also agree with the way that

3 Mr. Evan's did her budget that the golf

4 course money should have been used in this

5 fashion, not for the realty transfer tax.

6 That helped some realtors, it didn't help

7 any homeowners.

8 I want to continue reading some of

9 these excessive fines. I think people are

10 shocked. I know I have been getting phone

11 calls lately, especially after NCC sent out

12 that letter, that people are very, very

13 scared. I think we stopped at "G", it was

14 the $30 for the preparation and mailing of

15 any correspondence. I think stamps are 41

16 cents, $30 so -- "$175 for the preparation

17 and filing of the default judgment to

18 account for monies received in preparation

19 of filing to satisfy a judgment so filed."

20 I don't even know that what means

21 and I have doing this for 15 years. This is

22 so vague that that terrifies me, also. Are

23 they going to just imposed it on some people

24 in some cases? Nothing is outlined here.

25 "The actual filing and satisfaction of
.

89


1 liens in affect at the time a default

2 judgment is filed and satisfied as

3 established by the Office of the

4 Prothonotary," don't know what that means

5 either, "as charged with the establishment

6 of such fee."

7 That makes absolutely no sense.

8 It's extremely vague. "$800 for a sherif's

9 sale. The actual filing service, execution

10 and poundage fees, if any, for service and

11 execution by the Office of the Sherif of the

12 County which are in affect at the time of

13 such filing. Service and execution is

14 established by the sherif of the county or

15 such other instrumentality of the government

16 as shall be charged with the establishment

17 of such fee."

18 What fee? When, where, how, and

19 why?

20 "$175 for the preparation, filing

21 and conduct of proceedings to affect service

22 of process."

23 I'm assuming that refers back to the

24 one we just ready only I'm not sure.

25 "$30 for costs incurred in
.

90


1 connection with the reissuance of writs."

2 Don't know what that is.

3 "$50 for preparation and filing of

4 any petition to assess damages or similar

5 petition and motion."

6 What are the damages, who determines

7 what they are, how long is that in effect

8 for? Once again --

9 MS. GATELLI: Thank you.

10 MS. KRAKE: We'll continue, I still

11 have several more to go.

12 MS. GATELLI: Mr. Stuckard.

13 MR. STUCKARD: How you doing,

14 Mr. Courtright. Hi. We got the sign put of

15 this morning.

16 MR. COURTRIGHT: Did you? Good.

17 MR. STUCKARD: Yeah. I see that the

18 city truck with the thing on it, the boom on

19 to it and it came up and he put it up this

20 morning.

21 MR. COURTRIGHT: Okay.

22 MR. STUCKARD: So, what about Parrot

23 Avenue? Are they going to fix some holes?

24 I want to know what they are going to do,

25 what they are going to do with that Parrot
.

91


1 Avenue by George's Lumber? There is holes

2 there and holes and holes?

3 MR. COURTRIGHT: I know, Jim, and we

4 have asked them to. I'll ask them again.

5 MR. STUCKARD: What about that house

6 on Greenridge, that red house? Are they

7 going to see about getting that tore down or

8 the front porch is like everybody goes up

9 and down that street, Greenridge, I want to

10 know what they are going to do with that red

11 house, it's not by business, so -- there is

12 a lot of junk on the front porch.

13 MS. GATELLI: We'll ask about that

14 for you, Mr. Stuckard.

15 MR. STUCKARD: Last Thursday when I

16 left from here after I went home I got hit

17 by a car.

18 MS. GATELLI: Are you okay?

19 MR. STUCKARD: On Greenridge, up by

20 North Scranton High School, the old school.

21 MR. COURTRIGHT: On your bike?

22 MR. STUCKARD: Yeah. I got hit with

23 the car. I've been trying to wait for a

24 lady to call, Kay at Bill's Sporting Goods,

25 never got no answer yet, and she has got to
.

92


1 pay the hospital bill. So over there we

2 need a cop. Every -- right by the laundry

3 mat and up the street on Market Street, cars

4 parked by the laundry mat out in the street

5 and there is no reason for them to park

6 there out in the street, people can't get

7 down Greenridge -- up and down Market

8 Street. That block is really bad. See,

9 they are working on Mrs. Turner's lawn --

10 working on Mrs. Turner's place, there's a

11 dumpster there, they still can't get the

12 trucks up and down the road.

13 MS. GATELLI: Okay, Jim.

14 MR. STUCKARD: So we got to get a cop

15 out there or something.

16 MS. GATELLI: Okay. Thank you.

17 MR. STUCKARD: Okay, and I was -- the

18 other day riding with -- had to be Saturday,

19 Thursday or Friday last week, they are

20 ripping -- they are supposed to be

21 remodeling the TV shop, whoever bought that.

22 MR. GATELLI: Okay, Jim, we will find

23 out.

24 MR. STUCKARD: Jim, all right.

25 Thank you.
.

93


1 MS. GATELLI: Thank you.

2 MR. COURTRIGHT: Thanks, Jim.

3 MS. GATELLI: Mrs. Shumaker.

4 MS. SHUMAKER: Marie Shumaker. I'd

5 like to start out today by reading a

6 dialogue that is taken from the March 1,

7 2007, minutes. It's between Mr. Sbaraglia

8 and Mrs. Fanucci. It starts out by

9 Mr. Sbaraglia saying, "Okay, okay, let's go

10 on with the 408. We might as well get it

11 through. You know how much the building is

12 appraised at right now?"

13 MRS. FANUCCI: Yes.

14 MR. SBARAGLIA: What's it appraised

15 at?

16 MS. FANUCCI: $170,000.

17 MR. SBARAGLIA: Who appraised it?

18 MS. FANUCCI: They did not give me

19 the contractor's name who did the appraisal,

20 but it was appraised for $170,000, that did

21 include the business itself.

22 MR. SBARAGLIA: By a licensed

23 appraiser I assume?

24 MS. FANUCCI: Oh, yes, absolutely."

25 Well, I wrote a right-to-know letter
.

94


1 to OECD and asked for that appraisal and I

2 got a response saying there was no such

3 appraisal, so I sent a second letter and I

4 included that dialogue and I got another

5 letter back saying, "I am in receipt of your

6 referenced letter requesting under the

7 Pennsylvania Right to Know Act for a copy of

8 the appraisal of the 408 Cedar Avenue

9 property. My office did not have such a an

10 appraisal responsive to your request."

11 So, I would like to know where that

12 appraisal is and how one gets to see a copy

13 of it or who that licensed appraiser even

14 was.

15 Now, next, I'd like to go onto the

16 liens. Mrs. Gatelli, you said you would

17 have the council find out about the liens

18 for demolition and I would also like to note

19 that when all of the goodies were given for

20 that Granito property there was a lot of

21 hoopla about this was a gateway to south

22 side, well, that gateway looks pretty

23 terrible. I haven't seen any action there.

24 There was some action when they wanted these

25 loans subordinated and as soon as that got
.

95


1 passed there has been no action, the grass

2 is grown up, the property looks terrible.

3 Neck, Mrs. Evans isn't here, but I'd

4 like to know, I'd like an audit report

5 status when she returns.

6 Another question for Mrs. Gatelli on

7 the budget committee, who are the members

8 that are going to be meeting from 11 to 1 in

9 August, those three Thursdays, and how would

10 the public be allowed to participate in

11 those meetings if at all?

12 I noted into today's another -- a

13 different subject. I noted in today's paper

14 that Pittston had just raised their

15 franchise, their cable franchise rates from

16 3 percent to the legal limit of 5 percent

17 and I'd like to know what percent Scranton

18 gets for it's cable franchise fee.

19 And then I'd like to go back to

20 questions, several of the questions I asked

21 at the January meeting that I followed up

22 with e-mail questions and I still don't have

23 answers: Number one, very important, on the

24 real estate tax revenue in 2007 the budget

25 increased only 6 percent but the taxes were
.

96


1 raised 25 percent so why wasn't the revenue

2 in the 2007 budget increased 25 percent

3 instead of 6 percent? Why did the revenue

4 from theater licenses go from $3,000 in 2006

5 to zero in 2007? And, finally, what

6 accounts for the budget interest earnings to

7 increase from $150,000 to $436,601 for 2007?

8 Where is that additional principal this is

9 earning that increased interest squirreled

10 away, and now I'll take my seat so you can

11 respond. Thank you.

12 MS. EVANS: Mrs. Shumaker, I didn't

13 hear all of your questions, probably just

14 the last two, but I would request of you if

15 you can give me a copy of your list I'll

16 research all of that to you to the best of

17 my ability. I may get answers to some, I

18 may not to others, but I'd be happy to look

19 into it.

20 MS. SHUMAKER: I think that's your

21 answer about the status of the audit.

22 MS. EVANS: Oh, the audit is ongoing

23 but, again, I don't believe that it's going

24 to be ready until late autumn. As I said

25 before, it's always late, it's never arrived
.

97


1 at least during my ten-year by May 31 and

2 Mr. Pocius, a former council person, had

3 informed me that in his ten-years it had

4 never arrived by May 31 and I know he spent

5 many years on council. Most often it

6 arrives in September. At one point it

7 had -- - one year since I have been here it

8 was finished in August, but due to the fact

9 that it was begun so very late because we

10 were trying to hire a firm that would not

11 financially rape council on the audit, it's

12 been delayed, but that work, as I said, is

13 ongoing and it should be late fall, but it

14 is a very, very important piece of the

15 development of next year's budget and it's

16 virtually impossible to due I think an

17 appropriate job on the 2008 budget at least

18 from my perspective until you have got that

19 document in your hands.

20 MS. GATELLI: The only answers that I

21 have for you are that those budget meetings

22 will be, and they are just budget and

23 whatever, the 9th, the 16th and the 23rd

24 beginning at 11 a.m. and anyone can come if

25 you would like.
.

98


1 (Unaudible comments by Ms.

2 Shumaker.)

3 MS. GATELLI: Pardon?

4 MS. SHUMAKER: You said the budget

5 committee, who's on the budget committee?

6 MS. GATELLI: Pat Ackourey, Don

7 Kurchner, Cheryl Murnin and Mike Genello,

8 they were the ones that submitted letters of

9 interest.

10 MS. EVANS: Were they the individuals

11 you were meeting with prior to this,

12 remember, you were having budget sessions?

13 MS. GATELLI: I only met with them

14 once to give them --

15 MS. EVANS: Is that the same group?

16 Okay.

17 MS. GATELLI: Yes. The other project

18 that I'd like to comment on that you

19 mentioned was the Granito project. I have

20 to tell you that I am very disappointed in

21 what's happening because nothing is

22 happening. I called about when we did the

23 subordination I called to find out about

24 that and then all of a sudden a few little

25 things happened and we approved it and I
.

99


1 will have Kay send a letter both to OECD and

2 to the housing inspectors because it is very

3 unsightly and I expected the project to be

4 much further along than it is. It is now an

5 eyesore to the gateway of south side instead

6 of a center piece, so I, too, am very

7 disappointed and Mr. Pisano is a long time

8 friend of mine and I'm very disappointed.

9 Usually, when he does a project it's first

10 class, so I don't know what the problem is,

11 but we'll try to find out. Thank you.

12 MS. FANUCCI: As far as I'm concerned

13 with that loan, now, I don't refer exactly

14 what or when, but I provide what is provided

15 to me. I don't just come up here and they

16 tell me what is going on with the loans and

17 that's how I give you my information. I ask

18 them questions and I provide it and that's

19 what I did, so that pretty much is all I

20 have to say. I mean, I don't know what

21 their end of it is, but that's what I did.

22 I provided you with what I received at the

23 time.

24 MS. GATELLI: You can only give what

25 you are provided. If we are provided
.

100


1 information and we give it to you, that's

2 because that's what was given to us. It

3 necessarily isn't the truth.

4 MS. FANUCCI: I didn't ask for the

5 receipt of the, you know, the people who go

6 in and do the appraisal, I don't ask that.

7 I say, "Is an appraisal done?"

8 "Yes."

9 "What was the number?"

10 Okay, that's what I do. I don't

11 say, "I need proof of --" that's not my job,

12 it's their job to do with that the state

13 because they could not get the approval with

14 the state unless they, you know, do all of

15 that so I know there are checks and

16 balances, they have to provide that or they

17 can't do what they need to do, so there was

18 some type of appraisal done whether it was

19 the building or the equipment in the

20 building, so I'm not sure what we are

21 talking about so I don't want to get myself

22 into something, but usually it has to do

23 what is in the building or the name of the

24 business if they are selling a business that

25 already is in existence what the business
.

101


1 would be worth because of what they already

2 do in business terms, but there is a lot of

3 ways that they get to appraisal factors but

4 that's all I have.

5 MS. GATELLI: Who's next. Mr. Dudek?

6 And I have to excuse myself, I have an

7 appointment and I won't be able to stay for

8 the rest of the meeting. Mr. Courtright

9 will call me this evening with anything else

10 that anyone has for me to investigate.

11 Thank you very much. Or at the Novena

12 tonight, Mrs. Evans, I'll probably see you

13 later.

14 MR. DUDEK: Mrs. Gatelli, one quick

15 question before you leave, sometime between

16 say June 25 and June 30 did Mayor Doherty

17 call you into inform you that he lost

18 another grievance to the fire department?

19 MS. GATELLI: Uh-huh.

20 MR. DUDEK: Okay, that's what I'm

21 going to talk about because the mayor

22 apparently didn't spoon feed it to the

23 times, but we got it out of the Union News.

24 I gave everybody a copy of the Union News

25 and we ran into a very weird situation
.

102


1 there, or Paul Tucker did I should say, not

2 "we", I just help him with it. The paper

3 was all put together and ready to go when a

4 story finally broke his way and it had to

5 end up on page 11 or otherwise it would have

6 been the lead story, it would have been the

7 headline story. "City of Scranton violates

8 firefighter union contract by decreasing

9 staff," that's on page 11. Take the time to

10 read it when you can. The city lost another

11 one. The mayor apparently wants to reduce

12 the number of firemen to 112. Now, this

13 city has 26 square miles to it, it's too big

14 of a city to cover that way. Allentown has

15 about 100,000 people compressed into 16

16 square miles, but we have 26 square miles,

17 we still need to cover that kind of size

18 with the fire department properly staffed.

19 We cannot afford to let our fire department

20 lapse and let's put our mayor's feet to the

21 fire, not the people. Please, let's get

22 this done and let's get these contracts done

23 already, it's already an embarrassment with

24 the fire department and the police

25 department.
.

103


1 I got a call from a cousin of mine

2 who lives in San Diego who accesses the

3 Scranton Times-Tribune on the Internet and

4 he saw the story about the policemen getting

5 their own police cars and his take on that

6 story, he says, "ou know, your town of

7 Scranton is just an old mining town and

8 that's all it's ever going to be. The coal

9 miners had to buy their own dynamite, now

10 the cops have to buy their own cars.

11 Scranton just isn't going to change."

12 Let's face it, how else are you are

13 going to interpret that story? How else do

14 you interpret that? Honestly it's

15 ridiculous. And one last thing I want to

16 bring up, I want to thank city council for

17 taking a suggestion of mine that I had made

18 two years ago and that I made earlier last

19 year, timely as far as getting these

20 apartments in the City of Scranton properly

21 inspected. It brings us up to the level of

22 other cities doing precisely the same thing

23 that has been going back as far as

24 100 years. Thank very much.

25 MR. COURTRIGHT: Thank you. Bill
.

104


1 Jackowitz.

2 MR. JACKOWITZ: Bill Jackowitz, South

3 Scranton resident, retired United States Air

4 Force. The Scranton Pennsylvania Home Rule

5 Charter, Article 22 states that the mayor

6 has the authority to appoint his staff.

7 Now, Article 8, Section 802, testing and

8 appointing procedures, this is for full-time

9 employees, which I think the DPW director,

10 and so and so forth are. "Each vacant

11 full-time position shall be broadly

12 advertised for a period of at least ten

13 working days by posting notice of the

14 vacancy on bulletin boards at city work

15 locations and by advertising the vacancies

16 in at least one newspaper of general

17 circulation in the city."

18 I think that is a much better

19 solution to the problem is advertising it

20 and getting the best qualified people

21 instead of just making a political

22 appointee, especially when these people are

23 going to be in charge of budgets and

24 basically in charge of city departments.

25 That's just my personnel opinion, and I'll
.

105


1 stand behind that. I think you shouldn't be

2 appointing people to the Director of the

3 Public Works and Parks and Recreation, you

4 need qualified people, that's why Section 8t

5 is much better, because those people and the

6 workers have to be qualified, but

7 supervisors and leaders do not have to be

8 qualified and that's all I'm going to say on

9 that.

10 Taxpayers paying for swim/slide Nay

11 Aug Park. 17 June, 434 kids, $1,118.

12 Fourth of July, 26 kids, $78, bad weather.

13 18 July, yesterday for Sister Adrian, 144

14 kids, $432 for underprivileged children.

15 Total so far 604 kids at Nay Aug Park using

16 the slid and swim, $1,628. Last night

17 Mr. Tommy Lee, Sr., Shamrock Rod and Gun

18 Club of Minooka has made a commitment for

19 $200 a year for swimming/slide at Nay Aug

20 Park starting this year and for every year

21 that we have the program.

22 Mr. Jack Donlin, Minooka Lion's Club

23 has been a made a commitment to sponsor one

24 day of swim/slide at Nay Aug Park this year

25 and every year as long as we have the
.

106


1 program irregardless of what the cost may

2 be. This will be an ongoing commitment

3 until Nay Aug Park has free swimming and

4 slides for kids 15 and under.

5 At this time I would like to read

6 the list of contributors. If I go over my

7 five minutes, I hope you give me a couple of

8 extra seconds. Coney Island, Lackawanna

9 Avenue. Coney Island, Cedar Avenue. Bella

10 Pizza. Buona Pizza. Sam's Barber Shop.

11 Whistle's. Ground Round. Edward Chomko

12 Funeral Home. Nicholas Chomko Funeral Home.

13 Nativity Social Club. AZ's Tavern,

14 southside. Andrew Brown's. Costas Drug.

15 Smith's Restaurant. Sabroski's Garage.

16 Starr Uniforms. Chick's Diner. Union News.

17 Regan Funeral Home. Harrington's beer

18 distributor. Haas' Funeral Home. DiBileo

19 Insurance. Ferrario Insurance. Munchak

20 Insurance. Miller Bean Funeral Home, and

21 Miller Bean Funeral Home, they gave twice.

22 Paul, you know who you are. Mr. John Kuda.

23 Mr. Billy McClaine. Mr. Paul Jackowitz.

24 Mr. Mike Osborne. Mr. Bob Bolus. Scooter's

25 Hot Dogs. Mr. Dan Hubbard. Mrs. Elizabeth
.

107


1 Hubbard. Stange's Market in Minooka.

2 Commissioners Cordaro and Munchak. John's

3 Signs in Minooka. Congressman Kanjorski.

4 Mrs. Janet Evans. Mr. Bill Courtright.

5 Mrs. Sherry Fanucci. Mr. Robert McGoff.

6 Mrs. Judy Gatelli. Mr. Les Spindler.

7 Ralph, I can't remember your last name, but

8 you know who you are. Mrs. Nancy Krake.

9 Mr. Nelson Ancherani. Flashback's and

10 staff, they donated their time at our party,

11 the staff did. Penalty Box, they gave a

12 cash donation and food donation. Royal

13 Pizza. Subway and Electric City Pizza

14 downtown. Mrs. Concetti Reese,

15 Mrs. Victoria Mc Donald. Little Pete from

16 work, you know who you are. All of the

17 people who put money into the free swim

18 jars. Kost Tires. Scranton Ford.

19 Scranton/Lackawanna County Taxpayers

20 Association. Mrs. MaryAnn Hayes.

21 Magistrate Robert Russell. WILK radio.

22 Mr. Stanley Narsavage. Mrs. Maureen McGuire

23 and Mrs. MaryAnn Hayes.

24 Again, we are still accepting

25 contributions. Make the check payable to
.

108


1 Kids Free Swim, 1416 S. Webster Avenue,

2 Scranton, Pennsylvania, 18505. I would like

3 to see Mayor Doherty and Parks and

4 Recreation also give one day of free swim

5 and slide at Nay Aug Park, maybe a weekend,

6 a Saturday and a Sunday. I hope council

7 supports this and tries to get this, the

8 program is going good, it's a great program,

9 keep it going.

10 MR. COURTRIGHT: Thank you. Ron

11 Ellman.

12 MR. ELLMAN: Now that Mrs. Fanucci is

13 gone can I talk 15 or 20 minutes.

14 MR. COURTRIGHT: She is still there.

15 MR. ELLMAN: I mean Mrs. Gatelli is

16 gone I'll sit here and blabber for awhile.

17 You know, it seems that the more that I --

18 this meeting that, you know, when I don't

19 attend I have more people verbally attack me

20 about things I said six, eight months, a

21 year ago, I don't understand it. I sit out

22 here and listen and don't participate and

23 let other people say things and people, I

24 don't know, they bring up things that I said

25 last year, you know, attacks on the mayor
.

109


1 and so forth, we should be focused on the

2 city right now, not things I said a year

3 ago. I walked around the farmer's market

4 yesterday and I went with Miss Rosie and she

5 leaves me because she doesn't want to

6 acknowledge in public that she knows me I

7 guess and I had three or four different

8 couples come up and say all kind of things

9 that happened a year or two ago. I had one

10 couple though that they came up and they

11 accused me of being a homeless advocate and

12 wanting to on television and supporting a

13 city full of illegals just because I said

14 that, you know, I think it was last -- a

15 couple of weeks ago I made a remark that

16 these people from the housing complex need

17 to watch the mayor, he is going to sell them

18 out, he is going to sell them short, he

19 doesn't care about the little man. I didn't

20 say nothing about illegals and homeless

21 people, but I don't understand how I get so,

22 you know, get all of these attacks on me

23 when I'm trying to do something good. I

24 feel sorry for these people over here that

25 are being displaced for a school. The
.

110


1 college is the one that ought to move, not

2 hundreds of families out of their homes.

3 Those apartments should have been fixed up

4 immediately and it would have been no

5 expense to have the panels put in there to

6 fireproof them and let people in.

7 MR. COURTRIGHT: Mr. Ellman, I don't

8 think they are using those apartments, they

9 are using the ones on the other side of the

10 college.

11 MR. ELLMAN: Yeah, I'm talking about

12 the whole -- the college wants this whole

13 complex, the mayor has got an obsession with

14 this lousy medical school, there is eight

15 schools in there. There is no immediate

16 rush to put a medical school in here. I

17 think he plans to have this as his legacy

18 instead of looking at a bunch of trees and

19 saying that's my legacy years from now. You

20 know, if he wants a medical school so bad

21 why don't they put it over here where the

22 illegal plant is on Dickson Street.

23 Well, I don't want to start with

24 that. You know, I get up here and I don't

25 have an employer, I can sort of say what I
.

111


1 want and I try to speak the truth as I see

2 it. You know, Mr. Brown got to appease his

3 reporting, he can't say what's in his heart.

4 I have talked to him outside, because

5 sometimes I feel that he, you know, he is

6 controlled. He just can't seem to relate to

7 facts what's going on in the public out here

8 like most of us in here can.

9 Well, to get back to these people

10 and this project, it's just an upset, it's

11 an obscenity to move people out of these two

12 projects for a medical school. There is no

13 need for it, it's not right, the school

14 bought -- when Lackawanna College bought

15 that place they were limited then and they

16 should be limited to their territory right

17 now and these people should be given their

18 homes.

19 One of the couples that was talking

20 to me yesterday they said, you are talking

21 about people that don't pay rent in 30 or

22 40 years, they live free on the public, they

23 don't pay repairs and utilities and all, I

24 understand that, but that is because of poor

25 management in Scranton Housing that has gone
.

112


1 on year after year after year. The Bacon

2 boys did a terrible job, the place is run

3 down, it's nothing but a ghetto and I said

4 this, I don't know, last year that it ought

5 to be investigated and the next day was the

6 time they picked up their books. Thank you.

7 MR. COURTRIGHT: Thank you, Ron.

8 Les.

9 MR. SPINDLER: Good afternoon,

10 Council, Les Spindler. Mrs. Gatelli must

11 have ESP that I was going to talk about her,

12 she left. I came out of my vacation and I

13 guess I'll have to wait until September.

14 Anyway, moving on, last week a speaker

15 asked if those people that were hired if the

16 jobs had to be posted and Mr. Minora said

17 it's in the Home Rule Charter it states that

18 the mayor can hire whoever he wants, well,

19 we go by the Home Rule Charter to hire

20 people, but we don't go by the Home Rule

21 Charter for citizens participation? Either

22 you use the Home Rule Charter or you don't

23 use the Home Rule Charter.

24 Mrs. Fanucci, Mrs. Gatelli and

25 Mr. McGoff voted not to have citizens
.

113


1 participation before agenda items are voted

2 on, that's against the Home Rule Charter,

3 but now we hire people because it says --

4 the Home Rule Charter says the mayor can?

5 Well, what's right here? Either we use it

6 or we don't use it. I hope the people will

7 remember that in November, Mr. McGoff.

8 I wanted to say something to Mrs.

9 Fanucci, she must have ESP, too, I'll have

10 to wait for September for her, too, I guess.

11 When they had the anti-illegal immigration

12 rally in Scranton Mr. Doherty was quoted in

13 the paper as saying, "The problems of the

14 city aren't because of illegal immigrants."

15 Well, write this date down because I

16 agree with this Mayor Doherty, it's not

17 because of illegal immigrants. The problems

18 of the city are because of him.

19 I was going to talk about the

20 $300,000 dog park, but, Mrs. Evans, you

21 answered a lot of questions, but one thing

22 that jumped out at me is $46,000 for a

23 fence. Is the fence made out of gold?

24 MS. EVANS: No, I'm not sure it's not

25 made out of gold, but I didn't give up the
.

114


1 dimensions, the square feet, etcetera.

2 MR. SPINDLER: I understand.

3 MS. EVANS: So it's based on those

4 measurements.

5 MS. SPINDLER: Fine. It must be an

6 awful lot of fence. I'm going to bring this

7 up again, I have been saying it for how many

8 years, during the rain storm this morning my

9 house was flooded again. My lawn looked

10 like the Florida everglades, Mr. Courtright,

11 since we have a new DPW director do you

12 think we could get a letter sent to him?

13 MR. COURTRIGHT: I'll ask him ask,

14 Les. I mean, we have been asking. I think

15 all of us has asked many times.

16 MS. SPINDLER: You know how long I

17 have been asking.

18 MR. COURTRIGHT: Oh, yeah, as long as

19 I have been here.

20 MR. SPINDLER: Caused by what the

21 city did.

22 MR. COURTRIGHT: I understand.

23 MR. SPINDLER: Thank you.

24 MR. COURTRIGHT: Thank you. There is

25 no one else on the sign-in sheet. Did
.

115


1 anybody else want to speak? Hi, Dan.

2 MR. HUBBARD: Good evening, Council,

3 Daniel Hubbard. Well, I had kind of

4 intended, since I had been away for a few

5 weeks and decided to spend some daytime time

6 with my son instead of putting him with the

7 babysitter to come here to only have my

8 blood pressure go through the ceiling and

9 then go home aggravated, he doesn't deserve

10 that. I gave you violations that I feel and

11 that's basically what I feel are the most

12 significant violations. I'm not going to

13 nit-pick. The ones involving Section five

14 of the zoning ordinance environmental

15 protection I think are the priority and I do

16 think it's in order, the first statements on

17 those pages basically precede what follows,

18 okay?

19 Mrs. Gatelli leaving kind of

20 derailed me. At the last meeting I attended

21 she did make a comment to Mrs. Fanucci that

22 I was disgraceful as I was walking away from

23 the podium, which I found kind of funny

24 considering that same meeting she had

25 indicated that she was trying to use some of
.

116


1 the $281,000 from the Elm Street flood

2 project money to demo houses in south side.

3 The last I checked I would assume south side

4 is not considered a low income neighborhood,

5 and I was -- well, sections of south side I

6 certainly wouldn't consider a low income

7 neighborhood, I was told that that money was

8 HUD money and it was for low income

9 neighborhoods and so that's why we couldn't

10 have it in lower Greenridge for the flood

11 repairs on the riverbank bank because we are

12 considered low to moderate income and that

13 was also previous to when I was told that

14 money was designated to Elm Street

15 specifically even though it was actually

16 left over funds from the Pittston Avenue

17 project, so that hot potato got bounced

18 around and I guess it was to try and land in

19 south side for a demolition of houses to

20 increase property values. I would just like

21 some dirt on a riverbank. DPW is working

22 feverishly every day dumping more dirt on

23 the corner of Albright and Nay Aug to store

24 their fill from the Meadowbrook project that

25 they are getting for free from Linde
.

117


1 Industries. They are digging up a huge

2 trench for the Meadowbook project.

3 MR. COURTRIGHT: That's nice.

4 MR. HUBBARD: So all of the dirt

5 that's coming out of the hole where the

6 concrete is going is the city is getting for

7 free as fill. That's a good deal for the

8 city, they don't have to pay for dirt to

9 fill -- to fill the house in south side when

10 they demo them, but if they could I would

11 rather they store the dirt somewhere else

12 than in our neighborhood. It's very

13 discouraging for the residents to get up to

14 the morning and see DPW backhoes and dump

15 trucks feverishly working to push dirt

16 around right across the street from the

17 damaged riverbank that Mr. Parker, who now

18 is gone, conveniently said that he would

19 repair the sections that we discussed. I'm

20 sure Mr. Brazil has got a lot of on his

21 plate right now and he was probably given

22 the same marching orders as Mr. Parker was

23 in regards to the poor low income residents

24 in lower Greenridge, let's just let the area

25 flood.
.

118


1 There is lot of rumors flying around

2 about the Scranton Lace Works right now and

3 they pretty much all I think hinge on the

4 medical school. If the medical school ends

5 up where they are proposing it will I'm sure

6 LJC will end up in the Lace Works like they

7 had previously planned on doing. Mrs.

8 Fanucci said that that money is still in

9 play, so we don't get a riverbank but our

10 property values get run down to the bottom

11 of the barrel so that LJC can come in and

12 just purchase up the whole neighborhood

13 conveniently for their school. If not,

14 there are other rumors circulating that the

15 county commissioners and Mayor Doherty are

16 possibly looking at putting a stadium in

17 lower Greenridge. That's great. I'm not

18 going anywhere so they can buy me out, they

19 can try and buy me out. They can't afford

20 to pay for the boat that I want that I would

21 give up my house for, so I'll sell hot dogs

22 off my front porch or chase college students

23 out of my neighborhood or second base in the

24 infield.

25 Now, we've had several discussions
.

119


1 about the flood relocation specialists and

2 the coordinators and whatnot. There is two

3 businesses left in lower Greenridge and are

4 in process of being bought out right now.

5 One was Keystone Fence along Nay Aug Avenue.

6 They have since moved out of the city to

7 Olyphant so the city has lost another

8 business. They are arguing with the flood

9 control over office right now over their buy

10 out price. The other business is the Garden

11 Path Lawn and Garden Center. They have been

12 offered a ridiculously low buy out for the

13 land that they have, and the business that

14 they have. The buy out doesn't include any

15 loss of business due to moving to a new

16 location, let's face it, you take your

17 business where it's been for ten years, put

18 it somewhere else, you are going to lose

19 business, you are going to lose a lot of

20 business, so to offer them a low buy out is

21 -- is that five or -- five? Okay, real

22 quick, to offer them a low buy out is one

23 thing, if they don't want to accept the

24 offer that's up to them. We don't want to

25 see them leave the neighborhood. Look,
.

120


1 Mr. O'Hora made a comment that if lower

2 Greenridge floods that it will be their

3 fault because they are not accepting the buy

4 out and they are holding up the flood

5 project.

6 MR. COURTRIGHT: All right.

7 MR. HUBBARD: So these are really

8 good people that we have in the flood

9 control office. We are coming up on the end

10 of the summer and hurricane season and we

11 are looking forward to it. We don't have a

12 siren, we don't have repairs, we've got

13 nothing, one year and -- one year and a

14 month after the flood we have received nada,

15 not one little tiny piece of assistance.

16 MR. COURTRIGHT: Thank you, Dan.

17 Chrissy.

18 MR. SLEDZENSKI: What's up, Bill?

19 MR. COURTRIGHT: Hi, Chris.

20 MR. SLEDZENSKI: Can I bring it up,

21 Bill?

22 MR. COURTRIGHT: Sure, bring it up.

23 I thought you had a speech there. Who gave

24 you this, Ray Kelly?

25 MR. SLEDZENSKI: The dream game is
.

121


1 August 1 this year, Bill, August 1 is the

2 dream game at Albright Stadium. They're a

3 good bunch of kids up there, I'm going to

4 give them a lot of credit for that. Thank

5 you.

6 MR. COURTRIGHT: Thank you, Chris.

7 Hello.

8 MS. OWENS: Hi. Mary Ann Owens,

9 Scranton resident, taxpayer and Jonathan

10 Clauss' aunt. Doing, I thank you and junior

11 council for handicapped access swingset. I

12 thank everybody for that treehouse. It's

13 amazing that everybody that can walk and

14 that isn't handicapped can jump in a puddle,

15 but my nephew cannot jump in a puddle, he is

16 in a wheelchair.

17 We had a benefit sponsored by

18 Scranton at large, sponsored by Joe Talimini

19 which was here before, that was on June 15th

20 of 2007. It was a beautiful benefit and

21 lots of -- 50 people came, people spent

22 their money, people ate, people had

23 wonderful entertainment, but I'm very, very,

24 very disappointed at Joe Talimini. There

25 was $175 sent to Jonathan's trust fund at
.

122


1 Citizens Bank, and I know Janet and

2 Mr. McGoff have given a check and hopefully

3 it was deposited and cashed, but for the

4 raffles that I and others have spent cash,

5 my own money, $40, which it doesn't come

6 easy to any of us today, I haven't seen

7 anything being deposited in his account from

8 that fundraiser and I'm very disappointed.

9 I trusted somebody who thought was going to

10 do something good and he hasn't. I give him

11 4:00 today to hand in everything he has to

12 Citizens Savings account wherever in this

13 city and I can't believe it took one month

14 to put it in the bank because when I did the

15 fundraiser for Jonathan it was handed in the

16 next day, over $5,000, and I just can't

17 believe it, and I'm bringing this to city

18 council and people and please, please, help

19 me because I don't think it's right and I

20 want to see it for Jonathan. Thank you.

21 MR. COURTRIGHT: Thank you. Is there

22 anyone else? Anybody else want to speak?

23 MR. LYMAN: Raymond Lyman. Remember

24 a couple of weeks ago I said that I had a

25 letter from the Federal Attorney General's
.

123


1 Office and the ACLU and you guys laughed at

2 me and I know I see in today's paper the

3 ACLU was in the paper about Judy Gatelli and

4 Amil. Well, it's a surprise Mr. Minora,

5 Mrs. Gatelli is not here. Who is lying now?

6 Who is the liar now, Mrs. Fanucci.

7 MR. COURTRIGHT: Okay, Ray, let's --

8 MR. LYMAN: Hey, I have a right to

9 speak. You can't stop me.

10 MR. COURTRIGHT: Raymond, Raymond,

11 calm down.

12 MR. LYMAN: And I have a question,

13 let me speak. Where does it say in the

14 constitution that people can only speak for

15 five minutes? Ask your lawyer.

16 MR. COURTRIGHT: It's not in the

17 constitution.

18 MR. LYMAN: No. In the constitution

19 you can speak as long us want and this Rules

20 of Council does not exist. I can speak as

21 long as I want.

22 MR. COURTRIGHT: Raymond.

23 MR. LYMAN: The constitution

24 outrights any law in the land.

25 MR. COURTRIGHT: Raymond.
.

124


1 MR. LYMAN: The Federal Attorney

2 General, Mr. Johnson, told me --

3 MR. COURTRIGHT: You talked to a

4 Federal the Attorney General?

5 MR. LYMAN: That's what the letter

6 told me.

7 MR. COURTRIGHT: Oh, I thought you

8 said he told you.

9 MR. LYMAN: Well, in the letter

10 because Mr. Gonzalez is the federal attorney

11 general.

12 MR. COURTRIGHT: Okay.

13 MR. LYMAN: And in the letter it said

14 the constitution outranks the law of the

15 land, and I will get a copy from the library

16 and I will show our hack of lawyer --

17 MR. COURTRIGHT: Oh, no, no, no.

18 Raymond, Raymond, you can't say that.

19 MR. LYMAN: I'll say what I want.

20 MR. COURTRIGHT: Well, you can't.

21 MR. LYMAN: It's freedom of speech.

22 MR. COURTRIGHT: You can't call him

23 that. It's not right, Raymond, come on.

24 MR. LYMAN: Well, I'll say what --

25 he is not here.
.

125


1 MR. COURTRIGHT: Yeah, and that's

2 not true, he is not here to defend himself,

3 don't call him names, Ray.

4 MR. LYMAN: You said every time I

5 come here I'm out of order and no one else,

6 and I have a right to say what I want.

7 MR. COURTRIGHT: I never said you

8 were out of order, I said --

9 MR. LYMAN: No, but the queen mother

10 did.

11 MR. COURTRIGHT: See, you can't do

12 that, Raymond, you can't those names about

13 people. Please.

14 MR. LYMAN: The constitution says I

15 can say what I want.

16 MR. COURTRIGHT: It does not,

17 Raymond.

18 MR. LYMAN: And the Rules of Council

19 does not exist.

20 MR. COURTRIGHT: Raymond. Raymond,

21 hold on for one second.

22 MR. LYMAN: The constitution wants

23 freedom of speech.

24 MR. COURTRIGHT: Hold on for one

25 second. We adopt Rules of Council every two
.

126


1 years.

2 MR. LYMAN: I don't care about the

3 Rules of Council.

4 MR. COURTRIGHT: Well, you have to

5 care because they are the rules. You got to

6 go by the rules.

7 MR. LYMAN: The constitution outranks

8 Rules of City Council.

9 MR. COURTRIGHT: All right. I'm not

10 going to argue with you, Raymond, go ahead.

11 Continue.

12 MR. LYMAN: Because the Federal

13 Attorney General told me in the letter and

14 now you have the ACLU going after you and he

15 should tell you that you will be sitting in

16 jail.

17 MR. MINORA: You won't be sitting in

18 jail.

19 MR. LYMAN: Well, when you have the

20 Federal Attorney General, they had two guys

21 in suits coming around now and there was one

22 of them here that day taking photos, not

23 just the ACLU.

24 MR. COURTRIGHT: Raymond, how about

25 changing the subject, all right? You are
.

127


1 getting confrontational here, we don't want

2 that.

3 MR. LYMAN: It's freedom of speech

4 and it out ranks that five minutes, I can

5 speak as long as I want.

6 MR. COURTRIGHT: You can't speak as

7 long as you want.

8 MR. LYMAN: Mrs. Gatelli said to me

9 the last time I was here when she was mayor

10 she could pave the road. Well, I thought

11 that was an insult to me when all of her

12 friends got their streets paved, hey, I'm a

13 taxpayer, I'd like my street paved.

14 MR. COURTRIGHT: I'd like mine paved,

15 Oto.

16 MR. LYMAN: Well, you have a

17 business you can pave your sidewalk and your

18 street, you have a business, you can do it

19 yourself, not asking Mr. Kanjorski and make

20 my taxpayers pay for it, my taxes. I'd like

21 to have my street paved not year after year

22 after year and it's never done. This

23 sidewalks on Capouse Avenue all the way down

24 to the rebar and disabled people in

25 wheelchairs like this poor old lady that
.

128


1 have to go on the road in my neighborhood.

2 They don't deserve to go on the road. They

3 can go on the sidewalk but they can't.

4 Every year they do that.

5 We deserve to be treated like human

6 beings, not like animals, and every time I

7 come here up here I talk to the wall, I

8 don't deserve that. I deserve to be treated

9 like a human being, not like the queen

10 mother up there, Judy Gatelli.

11 MR. COURTRIGHT: Raymond, I'm not

12 going to allow you to -- the next time you

13 say that you are going to be out of order.

14 You can't be calling people names. Now,

15 that's it. That's it.

16 MR. LYMAN: Well, she treats me like

17 an animal.

18 MR. COURTRIGHT: She is not even

19 here, please.

20 MR. LYMAN: Every time when she is

21 here she hollers at me.

22 MR. COURTRIGHT: You speak to her

23 when she is here, all right?

24 MR. LYMAN: When I was here the last

25 time when we were being searched that Junior
.

129


1 Council got through because they -- Judy

2 Gatelli said, as I quote, "Be a member of

3 government," and we were all outside --

4 MR. COURTRIGHT: Your time is up,

5 Raymond, you got to sit down.

6 MR. LYMAN: And we were being

7 searched.

8 MR. COURTRIGHT: All right. Your

9 time is up now.

10 MR. LYMAN: Well, the five minutes

11 doesn't matter.

12 MR. COURTRIGHT: Raymond, you have to

13 sit down. Your time --

14 MR. LYMAN: Maybe I should talk to

15 Mr. Johnson --

16 MR. COURTRIGHT: Well, you talk to

17 him but for right now you got to ist down.

18 MR. LYMAN: -- his office again.

19 MR. COURTRIGHT: Right now you got to

20 step down, Raymond, your time is up.

21 MR. LYMAN: I'll talk to the ACLU

22 again and let's see --

23 MR. COURTRIGHT: Raymond --

24 MR. LYMAN: When they come after you

25 and --
.

130


1 MR. COURTRIGHT: Raymond, your time

2 is up, Buddy, sit down.

3 MR. LYMAN: -- see if guys don't like

4 it again.

5 MR. COURTRIGHT: Thank you. Is there

6 anyone else? No one? Come on. Okay. If

7 there is nobody else, a motion to adjourn?

8 MS. FANUCCI: Second.

9 MR. COURTRIGHT: Thank you. We are

10 adjourned.

11

12

13

14

15

16

17

18

19

20

21

22

23

24

25
.

131


1

2 C E R T I F I C A T E

3

4 I hereby certify that the proceedings and

5 evidence are contained fully and accurately in the

6 notes of testimony taken by me at the hearing of the

7 above-captioned matter and that the foregoing is a true

8 and correct transcript of the same to the best of my

9 ability.

10

11

12

13

14
CATHENE S. NARDOZZI
15 OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER

16

17

18

19

20

21

22

23

24

25