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1 SCRANTON CITY COUNCIL MEETING

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5 HELD:

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7 Thursday, January 11, 2007

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9 LOCATION:

10 Council Chambers

11 Scranton City Hall

12 340 North Washington Avenue

13 Scranton, Pennsylvania

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CATHENE S. NARDOZZI- COURT REPORTER
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2 CITY OF SCRANTON COUNCIL:

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MS. JUDY GATELLI, PRESIDENT
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6 MS. JANET E. EVANS

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MS. SHERRY FANUCCI
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9 MR. ROBERT MCGOFF

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MR. WILLIAM COURTRIGHT
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12 MS. KAY GARVEY, CITY CLERK

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MR. NEAL COOLICAN, ASSISTANT CITY CLERK
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15 MR. AMIL MINORA, SOLICITOR

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1 (Pledge of Allegiance recited.)

2 (Moment of silence observed.)

3 MS. GATELLI: Roll call?

4 MR. COOLICAN: Mrs. Evans?

5 MS. EVANS: Here.

6 MR. COOLICAN: Mrs. Fanucci?

7 MS. FANUCCI: Here.

8 MR. COOLICAN: Mr. McGoff?

9 MR. MCGOFF: Here.

10 MR. COOLICAN: Mr. Courtright?

11 MR. COURTRIGHT: Here.

12 MR. COOLICAN: Mrs. Gatelli?

13 MS. GATELLI: Here. Dispense with

14 the reading of the minutes?

15 MS. GARVEY: Third order, 3-A,

16 MINUTES OF THE SCRANTON LACKAWANNA COUNTY

17 HEALTH AND WELFARE AUTHORITY MEETING HELD ON

18 NOVEMBER 16, 2006.

19 MS. GATELLI: Are there any comments?

20 If not, received and filed.

21 MS. GARVEY: That's all I have.

22 MS. GATELLI: Before we start I'd

23 just like to remind everyone to please turn

24 off your cell phones. I'd like to start by

25 reminding everyone that there will a very
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1 busy weekend in Scranton. We will be

2 celebrating Martin Luther King Day on Monday

3 and there have been a variety of events

4 setup throughout the whole weekend in honor

5 of Martin Luther King. On Saturday, there

6 will be a bus tour by the Center of

7 Anti-Slavery studies. On Sunday at 6:00

8 p.m. at Scranton High School there will be a

9 multi-culture event including the Brown

10 Sugar High Steppers which I understand are

11 very excellent dancers, and music for the

12 black, Latino and Jewish communities. The

13 guess speaker there will be Lamar Thomas.

14 That's at 6:00 p.m. on Sunday.

15 On Monday at 10:30 at the University

16 of Scranton for preteens there will be a

17 justice program and speeches and music. At

18 1:15 at the United Neighborhood Centers for

19 all teenagers there will be a variety of

20 activities teaching the history of Martin

21 Luther King. At 4:15 at United Neighborhood

22 Centers there will be a sandwich dinner for

23 the march participants. At 5:00 there will

24 be a march walking from the United

25 Neighborhood Centers to courthouse square
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1 and that is for all. All ages, all races,

2 please participate. You go up to courthouse

3 square where there will be a ceremony and

4 city and county dignitaries will speak.

5 From there, they will go to the Scranton

6 Cultural Center at 6:30 for cake and hot

7 cocoa and at 7:00 a celebration at the

8 Stallard Temple that will be an interface

9 service, so I encourage all to participate

10 in these activities.

11 The second thing is that we received

12 a donation from the Christian Science

13 Society of Lackawanna County to the City of

14 Scranton Fire Department in the amount of

15 $100 to be deposited into a special city

16 account fire department only so we would

17 like to thank them for their donation.

18 Mr. Parker's report this week:

19 Potholes were repaired on Hennessy Street,

20 Shayler, White Tail Drive, Crossin Court,

21 Philmore, Sumner and Rebecca, Ash, Linden,

22 Oram, St. Ann's, Taylor. Thee was a clean

23 up of Fir Street from the flooding, and

24 trees were removed from Electric Street,

25 North Main, Frank, Washington Avenue,
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1 Connell Park and the Alder Street extension.

2 A gentleman wrote us a letter last

3 week about handicapped ramps that were in

4 disrepair. I have tried to contact him by

5 phone, but I can't seem to reach him, and I

6 would like him to note that I have called

7 Keith Williams from the Center for

8 Independent Living and Keith is going to

9 inspect these intersections and get back to

10 council on his findings and he did tell me

11 that there is a problem at the corner of

12 Wyoming and Spruce and that curb cut is

13 going to be repaired. It's going to be dug

14 up because it's undone and it's already on

15 the roster to be fixed. So, as soon as I

16 get anymore information from Keith Williams

17 on the ramps I will make a report.

18 The amusement tax someone e-mailed

19 me, I think it was Mr. Quinn, and Amil has

20 already prepared that ordinance, he is fine

21 tuning it and it should be ready within the

22 next few weeks for council to vote on it and

23 it is a good way to make revenue and we have

24 discussed it at this council meeting before

25 about an amusement tax so that is being
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1 constructed by Attorney Minora.

2 There are several problems, one is

3 on Slocum Avenue that was reported for

4 garbage. The 400 of Sixth Street, the catch

5 basin on Elmhurst Boulevard will be repaired

6 within the next two to three weeks. The

7 house on the 1,000 block of South Webster

8 has been approved for demolition and we

9 wrote to the Career Technology center on

10 Rockwell, Greenbush and Reese Street has

11 been reported already to Mr. Parker. From

12 what I understand Mr. Courtright already

13 reported it and I did, too.

14 The next thing I have is there was a

15 meeting in Keyser Valley concerning their

16 flooding problems that they have with that

17 and I was unable to attend this time,

18 Mrs. Evans and Mr. Courtright attended and

19 Mr. Courtright would like to give a report

20 on that.

21 MR. COURTRIGHT: Later on when we

22 make motions myself or somebody else will be

23 making a motion to ask the mayor and

24 Mr. Parker if they would be willing to come

25 to a caucus with the people from the Keyser
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1 Valley West Mountain Area. They discussed

2 several items about flooding in that area

3 and it wasn't just limited to Keyser Valley

4 and West Mountain, but that was mainly at

5 the meeting and at the end of the meeting

6 after I think I was there for over two hours

7 there was a vote taken by the citizens and

8 the vote was to ask for a caucus. I told

9 them that either myself or somebody else

10 here would be willing to make the motion. I

11 could not guarantee them that Mr. Parker or

12 the mayor would come, but I, myself, or if

13 anybody else would like to make a motion

14 tonight and ask that a letter be sent to

15 Mr. Doherty and Mr. Parker, they were hoping

16 for next week. If that's acceptable by

17 everybody on council then we will make it

18 for next week and I told them I would get

19 back to them.

20 So, Kay, when I do make the motion

21 or whoever does later on in the meeting when

22 we send the letter out can we ask for a very

23 quick response because some of them were

24 willing to take off work or leave early or

25 do what they need to do and if they are
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1 willing to attend, Mr. Parker and

2 Mr. Doherty, fine. If not, I'd like to tell

3 them so they are not rearranging their

4 schedule for no reason.

5 MS. GARVEY: Okay.

6 MR. COURTRIGHT: Just many, many

7 issues we discussed. Mary Alice Burke

8 really, really has a handle on the problems

9 back there and it was a well attended

10 meeting and it's my hope that something will

11 get done. There was some minor problems

12 from drainage blockage in some pipes that

13 were broken that I think that the City could

14 address rather quickly and I ultimately hope

15 they will, and there are others that are

16 going to take quite some time to get

17 remedied, but hopefully at this caucus they

18 can get the answers that they were looking

19 for because myself and Mrs. Evans and Frank

20 Andrews and former Mayor Connors and

21 representatives from Mr. Mellow's office

22 were there, representatives of Mr. Munchak

23 was there, Mr. Washo was there, just a whole

24 host of people, but I think the bottom line

25 is that it has to come from the City first
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1 and Mr. Parker I believe would be the guy

2 that would be most knowledgeable or be able

3 to give us the answers or give them actually

4 the answers that they were hoping to

5 receive. So hopefully we will make that

6 motion tonight and maybe we'll be able to

7 have a caucus next week. Thank you.

8 MS. GATELLI: Anyone else?

9 Mrs. Garvey, I don't think it's necessary to

10 have a motion to have a public caucus, I

11 don't believe so, I will just schedule it at

12 5:45 and I will contact Mr. Parker and the

13 mayor and see if --

14 MS. GARVEY: That's the one that's

15 Bill is speaking of?

16 MS. GATELLI: Yes. Just schedule it

17 for next Wednesday.

18 MS. GARVEY: 5:45?

19 MS. GATELLI: At 5:45. Is that a

20 public caucus here in this --

21 MS. GARVEY: Yes.

22 MS. GATELLI: And also I'll call the

23 mayor and Mr. Parker and see if they can

24 come and I'll have them let me know on

25 Monday.
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1 MR. COURTRIGHT: Just so they can

2 arrange their schedules. Thank you.

3 MS. GATELLI: Anyone else care to say

4 anything at this time? Okay. First speaker

5 is Doug Miller.

6 MR. MILLER: Good evening, council.

7 Doug Miller. Back in September the junior

8 council announced a children's handicapped

9 accessible swingset project that we do plan

10 on purchasing for Nay Aug Park and over the

11 Italian Festival we sold raffle tickets and

12 we raised money towards this project.

13 Unfortunately, though, it seems like this

14 project has been forgotten by some and we

15 don't want this project to be forgotten and

16 we are asking anyone out there who would be

17 interested in contributing to this project

18 to please make checks payable to the junior

19 council swingset project and mail them to

20 city hall. We want the handicapped children

21 in the city to have something to look

22 forward to this summer.

23 This past Tuesday in the USA today

24 the newspaper which listed all major events

25 that are taking place in each state and the
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1 city, the City of Scranton was mentioned due

2 to the smoking ban and how I, again, would

3 like to commend the students from West for

4 making this an actual story. The kids

5 brought this idea forward, not council, and

6 I am very proud of my fellow classmates. We

7 are not just hooligans at West, the kids do

8 have brains and they do speak out. And it

9 looks like we have a teacher and some

10 students from West here tonight and I would

11 like to welcome them to the meeting.

12 I was thinking with the smoking ban,

13 billions of dollars are being spent in the

14 transportation industry to clean air from

15 diesel fumes by cleaning the fumes from the

16 diesel engines. With this new technology

17 the exhaust fumes which used to burn at 500

18 degrees now burn at 1100 degrees. The

19 environment is being cleaned with this new

20 technology. This costing billions of

21 dollars to the industries which is then

22 passed along to the consumer.

23 With this in mind, we now have

24 people who own bars and other establishments

25 who feel the law regarding the smoking ban
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1 does not apply to them. This past week I

2 read an article in the paper from a bar

3 owner saying that this smoking ban does not

4 apply to them because they are not going to

5 enforce it. Well, from what I know the law

6 is the law and the law is supposed to be for

7 everyone but the people in this newspaper

8 who are breaking the law believe that they

9 are above the law and I guess I would say to

10 all you kids under 18 who can't smoke or buy

11 cigarettes because it's illegal and it is

12 the law, go to these bars and light up

13 because according to these bar owners this

14 ban is unenforceable and they apparently

15 don't believe in the law so go to the bar

16 and light up and you will get away with it.

17 And I would ask this council tonight

18 and the mayor to utilize the $1.5 million

19 from the golf course now to enforce the

20 smoking ban to preserve our health and

21 safety in the city. Since the money was

22 supposed to be a trust for our future and

23 used for parks and recreational purposes

24 where the interest would have only been

25 spent, the money was -- the money should be
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1 used to protect the health and safety of our

2 city because it has not been used -- it was

3 not used for it's intended purpose. Thank

4 you.

5 MS. GATELLI: Thank you. I think the

6 first speaker is Nancy Krake. If I miscall

7 you I apologize because there is lot of

8 names scratched off here and I don't know

9 who is who.

10 MS. KRAKE: Good evening, council,

11 my name is Nancy Krake. The 2007 tax

12 increase of 25 percent was brought to you by

13 Mrs. Fanucci, Mrs. Gatelli and Mr. McGoff.

14 The mayor is having Channel 61 stop

15 broadcasting live. This is another nail in

16 the coffin in our right to know how our tax

17 dollars are being spent. The mayor with the

18 help of possibly his three council votes

19 Fanucci, Gatelli and McGoff will be

20 virtually doubling your taxes in the next

21 few years. Now, without Channel 61, since

22 by the way, the Scranton Times has yet to

23 tell you about the budget and the increases

24 in your real estate taxes, the citizens of

25 Scranton will never know the truth about
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1 anything, about how the money is spent or

2 how their city government is performing or

3 not performing.

4 And, by the way, that was quite a

5 performance by three council people last

6 week. Mrs. Fanucci, from what I can

7 understand feels that there will be lot of

8 money brought in from the smoking fine and

9 that would be a good way to help bring funds

10 into our city. Brilliant economic strategy.

11 I think I'll start smoking so I can be cited

12 and we'll get rid of distressed status. For

13 me personally, it would be worth it.

14 Mr. McGoff's Hitler impression was also

15 very interesting. He knows so much more

16 than our founding fathers about freedom of

17 speech and efficient government that he fits

18 right in with the Third Reich. After all,

19 he was elected by three huge votes. I did

20 see him Pledge Allegiance to the flag though

21 so maybe he has turned the corner.

22 And, by the way, you can cut my time

23 to one second at a time and I guarantee I

24 will be here week after week, word after

25 word, telling everybody what goes on. The
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1 Academy award, however, goes to

2 Mrs. Gatelli. Her near death experience

3 during citizen's participation and her

4 miraculous recovery in time to vote for all

5 the mayor's agenda items and especially the

6 limiting of speaker's rights was

7 outstanding.

8 Mrs. Evans and Mr. Courtright did

9 not vote to raise your taxes. They

10 supported Mrs. Evans budget proposals and

11 that did not raise real estate taxes and

12 would have actually started to pay off the

13 disastrous debt. And, finally, where are

14 all of the mayor's supporters that were here

15 during the race for the mayor. Kind of hard

16 to come up here to be proud of a big fat tax

17 increase. Thank you.

18 MS. GATELLI: Dave Gervasi.

19 MR. GERVASI: Good evening, Council.

20 My name is Dave Gervasi, I'm a citizen on

21 the City of Scranton. I have a question for

22 council, is it true that Channel 61 is going

23 to be kicked out of that back room? Does

24 anyone know for sure?

25 MS. FANUCCI: They did say --
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1 MS. EVANS: Yes.

2 MR. GERVASI: Has the mayor

3 approached anybody at city council to talk

4 about that issue?

5 MS. EVANS: Not I.

6 MR. GERVASI: No one. Is this city

7 council going to allow it to happen?

8 MS. FANUCCI: Dave, you want me to

9 talk about this? Last week we met with 61

10 and we asked -- and they asked us if they

11 could move up the balcony and we all agreed

12 unanimously that we would support that, that

13 we would have no problem with that.

14 MR. GERVASI: Was there a problem

15 with the City in the last two days about

16 maybe the mayor doesn't want them in the

17 balcony.

18 MS. FANUCCI: Not that I am aware of.

19 I mean, as far as I'm concerned that's how

20 we left the meeting last week. They were

21 going to move up -- take up to two seats in

22 the balcony and that's where they were going

23 to put their feed.

24 MR. GERVASI: That would be great.

25 It's a shame, but at least they would still
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1 be here.

2 MS. FANUCCI: Well, I think they are

3 using that back room because of the heating

4 system, that was the idea, but we all agreed

5 that they would move up to the balcony, so

6 that's the last I heard and that was last

7 week.

8 MR. GERVASI: It's my understanding,

9 and correct me if I'm wrong, is city council

10 not in charge of this building and not the

11 mayor?

12 MR. COURTRIGHT: This room.

13 MR. GERVASI: This room.

14 MR. COURTRIGHT: Mrs. Gatelli might

15 be able to answer that. So we don't

16 have speakers -- and could you hold Mr.

17 Gervasi's time, it's going to take me a

18 little bit to explain this. So that we

19 don't have speaker after speaker I think

20 everybody is concerned about that and I

21 think I know what you are talking

22 Mr. Gervasi, I have probably heard the same

23 rumors you have.

24 First let me state that last week

25 when I walked into the caucuses, Mrs. Evans
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1 was already there, Mr. Finnerty from Channel

2 61, Mr. McGoff wasn't there yet and they had

3 pretty much I believe talked about

4 everything that was going on with 61 and

5 they agreed those three that, you know, to

6 allow 61 to broadcast from the balcony live,

7 no problems. I agreed and I pretty much

8 thought it was a done deal, and I don't know

9 if I spoke to Mr. McGoff afterward about it,

10 he came in a little bit later, but this week

11 there has been rumors around and I think

12 they might be a little bit of validity that

13 they are not going be allowed to go up there

14 because of the fact that the wiring or

15 whatever the case may be might be a safety

16 hazard. Well, this is a rumor and I think

17 that's possibly what Mr. Gervasi is

18 referring to; right?

19 MR. GERVASI: That's what I just

20 referring to; right.

21 MR. COURTRIGHT: And I'm going to

22 say for me, and I obviously won't speak for

23 anybody else, if by some chance putting it

24 up there is a safety hazard or whatever the

25 rumor is then I would have no problem moving
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1 that desk, nothing against you people, move

2 that table out of there and let them be

3 right there because I don't think, and if

4 you are please speak up, anybody is opposed

5 to them broadcasting here, so if anybody is

6 please say that you are, but I just thought

7 that might save some time for speaker after

8 speaker asking the same questions, so my

9 impression is that everybody on this council

10 and, again, if I'm wrong correct me, is all

11 in favor of these meeting being broadcasted

12 live from this council chamber.

13 MS. EVANS: Mrs. Gatelli, can I just

14 add something?

15 MS. GATELLI: Yes.

16 MS. EVANS: Mr. Finnerty I believe

17 also stated that at one time Channel 61

18 actually had their equipment located in the

19 balcony and that it worked very well and

20 that they would be very pleased to make the

21 balcony their permanent home, so I can't

22 imagine why suddenly there would be any

23 problems with that. And as Mr. Courtright

24 said, should any type of unforeseen problem

25 arise then I agree, let them place the
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1 equipment here and if that arises any

2 further controversy involving placement of

3 the equipment or the broadcasting of council

4 meetings then I would be willing to go so

5 far as taking council meetings elsewhere to

6 a location where these meetings can be

7 broadcast from because I think right now

8 they are probably the most important, the

9 most vital source of information in this

10 area, not only in the City of Scranton but

11 throughout this area and it's something that

12 we absolutely cannot afford to lose.

13 MR. GERVASI: Well, it's very

14 encouraging to hear those answers and I

15 appreciate the support of City Council to

16 keep 61 here and there is a few reasons

17 because of it and the reason why I am here

18 tonight is because this was bringing up

19 painful memories back in 2002 when the

20 recovery plan was going on. All of a sudden

21 when council speakers, particularly the

22 union representatives, were coming here and

23 explaining to the people of the City of

24 Scranton what exactly is in the recovery

25 plan that the mayor was touting and the
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1 problems within the recovery plan the prior

2 council decided that it was okay to shut

3 this room down and begin painting. The Ice

4 Box complex went up faster than it took to

5 paint this room, so it was very obvious to

6 us that it was a way for the City to stifle

7 information being disseminated to the public

8 about very important issues and we have the

9 newspaper beating us up and we all know how

10 accurate the newspaper is all the time, if

11 this show shuts down it's bad enough now

12 that the people in the City cannot watch

13 this show live on Thursday nights, people

14 have things to do on Friday mornings and on

15 Friday nights and on Saturday mornings and

16 on Sunday nights and on Sunday mornings when

17 it's the last time they televise it people

18 are normally in church or out doing things

19 with their family on a Sunday.

20 This is crucial that this station

21 remains here. Mr. Finnerty and Ms. Marks

22 and all of the people that volunteer all of

23 their time to come here so that the people

24 in the City of Scranton, especially the

25 people who don't have access to be able to
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1 come down here can see how the government

2 operates, and I'm sure there is a ton of

3 people that don't like what I say and there

4 are things that people out here say that I

5 don't like to hear either, but the fact is

6 this is your government in action, this is

7 not censored, this is not sanitized, this is

8 not biased and it's not slanted. What

9 happens at this podium and what happens from

10 that dais is the truth, it's live, and it's

11 not edited.

12 And that's the most important thing

13 the City can ever have with the regime that

14 we have in office right now and this is the

15 only way you can find out what's going on in

16 this town and I would find it unconscionable

17 if any of these council members cow-toes to

18 the mayor and has Channel 61 kicked out of

19 here and they can't have a live broadcast

20 because if you would remember when they shut

21 this room down last time there was not one

22 council member up here that was there at the

23 time they were all removed from office.

24 Thank you very much.

25 MS. GATELLI: Andy Sbaraglia.
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1 MR. SBARAGLIA: Andrew Sbaraglia,

2 citizen of Scranton, fellow Scrantonian. I

3 want to talk about the loan, your item 7-E

4 specifically, this is the $250,000 UDAG loan

5 and from what Mrs. Fanucci said this is some

6 type of an electrical distributor. Do you

7 know that it's a half a block from

8 All-Phase?

9 MR. COURTRIGHT: Yes.

10 MR. SBARAGLIA: Do you know also

11 that it's located in a very narrow alley?

12 MR. COURTRIGHT: Yes.

13 MR. SBARAGALIA: All of these things

14 are very negative. Now, I have nothing

15 against this man locating his business in

16 different parts of the city, but I think

17 All-Phase, and there is three distributors

18 already in that area. This is the secondary

19 loan, it's not even a primary, we are going

20 to give them $250,000 for a secondary

21 mortgage on his property.

22 Now, from what I read in the

23 brochures it was from four to eight jobs he

24 would create. It's not saying that people

25 have to be from Scranton, he just has to
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1 create four to eight jobs. Four in the

2 first I guess initial and then after three

3 years number eight. But did anybody at all

4 ask All-Phase or any of them other

5 distributors in this area whether they would

6 welcome this kind of competition this close?

7 MR. COURTRIGHT: Yes.

8 MR. SBARAGLIA: You did? What did

9 they say?

10 MR. COURTRIGHT: I didn't ask them

11 they called me.

12 MR. SBARAGLIA: Well, I assume they

13 would.

14 MR. COURTRIGHT: And they knew a

15 whole lot more about it because, you know,

16 they are competitive, not All-Phase, but

17 there is another, I'm not going to say the

18 name of the company, they're not happy.

19 It's competition.

20 MR. SBARAGLIA: Well, there is three

21 of them in there. There's -- up the street

22 there is one of them.

23 MR. COURTRIGHT: I don't want to say

24 the company's name.

25 MR. SBARAGALIA: And there is also
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1 one somewhere up there across from the

2 Giant. Like I say, I'm quite familiar with

3 electrical outlets that are currently in

4 this area, because as you know, when I

5 worked at the trades I used to do business

6 with them all. But, anyway, I would think

7 that's a serious consideration. Do we

8 know-- you know, he wants to buy the

9 building -- do we know who owns that

10 building and how long did that person own

11 that building? In other words, I don't want

12 back door deals that hurt these other

13 distributors because this is done in a back

14 way. In other words, if this man bought

15 this building say within the last six months

16 and then he could turn around and sell it to

17 this because obviously this thing was in the

18 works for quite a lot of months, too, and

19 these are things you really should look

20 into.

21 Now, I have nothing -- if them other

22 people are quite happy with that I have

23 nothing against it because, like I said, it

24 don't affect me anymore anyway other than

25 the fact is one of these other places, if
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1 that place should fold it's UDAG's money and

2 I don't think we have to replace it. If it

3 was borrowing it from one of the government

4 agencies and we had to replace that funds

5 then it's -- you have to look at it a lot

6 more closely. If this is a throw away like

7 so many of the UDAG loans are, as you know,

8 there is quite a few given and then after a

9 few many years they didn't have to repay

10 them that's in there, too, that was in quite

11 a few of the legislation past.

12 But, like I say, it doesn't affect

13 me anymore other than the fact that may it

14 affect us in our taxation later down the

15 pike and the fact that is if this new

16 distributor should go belly up that's

17 $250,000 that are lost that could be loaned

18 out to other industries that maybe would a

19 lot better for the city other than the city

20 people is what is in this. They may go up

21 to eight, they may not, depending on if they

22 can last long enough to do it. That's all I

23 have to say on that.

24 MS. FANUCCI: Andy, I can tell you a

25 little bit of something, this is not their
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1 first company that they are opening, this is

2 like their fourth or fifth like almost a

3 franchise that this company has. This is

4 not their first shot at business. They are

5 very eager from what I heard to relocate to

6 Scranton and open up a franchise-type of

7 business here. This is not a new deal for

8 them. From what I heard, they are not

9 looking for, you know, to flip this. They

10 are looking for long-term settlement, growth

11 and development in our area and to me to

12 chastise somebody I understand. I know if

13 I'm in business I don't want another

14 business moving next to me, but competition

15 breeds good business and to me I think

16 welcome them here and I don't see any back

17 door deals either, Andy, that I can figure.

18 MR. MINORA: Five minutes.

19 MR. SBARAGLIA: She took up the few.

20 The only thing I want to say one more thing

21 on it.

22 MS. GATELLI: Well, go ahead, but --

23 MR. SBARAGLIA: Well, I didn't ask

24 that question.

25 MS. GATELLI: Okay.
.

29


1 MR. SBARAGLIA: That was volunteered.

2 Then I was going to ask her then why the

3 secondary loan, why not the first mortgage?

4 MS. GATELLI: Maybe Attorney Minora

5 can answer that because most of the loans we

6 incurred were secondary, too. We're usually

7 in second place.

8 MR. MINORA: Yes, it's not an unusual

9 thing for UDAG to do that, a second loan.

10 MS. GATELLI: Yeah, it's very normal

11 to be in second place. Ozzie Quinn.

12 MR. QUIN: Robert Ozzie Quinn,

13 president of the Scranton Lackawanna

14 Taxpayers and Citizens Association,

15 Incorporated. The first thing I want to do

16 is I want to thank Kay and Neil for the

17 professional help they gave me and they gave

18 me the information I need. Thank you, Kay

19 and Neil. I just want to tell you also that

20 we have the reelection of officers for

21 Scranton Taxpayers Association,

22 Scranton/Lackawanna Taxpayers Association,

23 and I'll be returning as the president. Lee

24 Morgan is the vice-chairman, Tom Lavarsky is

25 the treasurer, Patricia Alody is the
.

30


1 secretary.

2 I want to start in regards to a

3 follow-up of last week's meeting when I

4 spoke about the real estate tax in regards

5 to offsetting the transfer tax for the

6 properties, okay? First of all, the intent

7 of the ordinance for selling the former

8 Scranton Municipal Golf Course was for parks

9 and recreation and I will show that through

10 to the minutes which I got from Neil and

11 Kay, okay? And I think by you people using

12 this money to offset that Recorder of Deeds

13 tax is misappropriating that line item,

14 those funds, and I want to explain it to

15 you, okay? That there was an ordinance for

16 the passing of the municipal golf course

17 from the Scranton Municipal Recreation

18 Authority to the City of Scranton on

19 November 25 and I have the minutes here

20 verbatim and it says, "So I agree with the

21 mayor, I agree with Mr. Dibelo for a

22 transfer or what happens? Can we put

23 directly into our parks system the money

24 would not loose much in negate a lot in

25 terms of recapitalizing Nay Aug, Weston
.

31


1 Park, Weston Field and some other places. I

2 don't see the down side of this. Our

3 argument with this people who think this is

4 selling of an asset."

5 Next, this is an emergency

6 certificate now, this is in 2003, emergency

7 certificate for sale on that -- for selling

8 that golf course, okay? Emergency and it's

9 2007. Actually, it's four years and we

10 still have that money and I'm going to

11 mention the person's name because it's an

12 official record, it's in the minutes.

13 "Mr. Gilhooley: I think this is --

14 the sale of this golf course is as much

15 about a philosophy as it is about a golf

16 course. This mayor and I think this council

17 are somewhat bent on changing the status quo

18 in the City of Scranton. We are going to

19 try to do business differently. We are

20 trying to change what has been done and make

21 it better and I think we succeeded on a

22 couple of months already. One of the fronts

23 the mayor has identified and we have agreed

24 with him, at least some of us have, is the

25 city's parks system. The city's park system
.

32


1 has been neglected for years, for many, many

2 years. It's time to get some money to

3 identify the money for the rehabilitation of

4 these parks and some of that money is going

5 to come at this juncture from the golf

6 course. The golf course over the years has

7 not generated enough money in my mind to

8 consider it an asset. At times we have

9 gotten $200,000 -- $200,0000 and a 56

10 million budget is about one third of 1

11 percent ever the budget. If just isn't

12 enough money. We are at a junction now

13 where the golf course needs to be

14 capitalized. There is still detriment.

15 It's time to change the way we do business.

16 It's time to get some money and put it into

17 Nay Aug which we have already begun the

18 process of doing, to put it into Weston

19 Park, to put it into Weston Field, the

20 people may not have agreed that this is it

21 the best way, but that is the philosophy.

22 The philosophy is to change the way we have

23 done things over the past several years.

24 This is just one of those cogs in the wheel

25 and because I think that the parks deserve
.

33


1 it, the City parks deserve to be fixed and

2 if we can fix it out of this money and it

3 can be utilized. I'm supporting the sale of

4 this golf course."

5 That was Mr. Gilhooley, okay? And I

6 think the council obviously you take of that

7 selling of the golf course and the ordinance

8 was for that money to be used for parks and

9 recreation. There is no doubt about it.

10 And I would have your solicitor look at it

11 okay? And that passed and they also passed

12 an emergency certificate for the auction of

13 the golf course. My -- I just want to --

14 case in point, was that when Mr. Doherty was

15 council they bid out the golf course and

16 there was a 4 million dollar bid and Mr.

17 Doherty refused to sell that golf course.

18 Now, he sold the golf course --

19 MR. MINORA: Ozzie, that's five

20 minutes.

21 MR. QUINN: That isn't five minutes.

22 MR. MINORA: That's five minutes.

23 MS. GATELLI: Thank you. James

24 Stuckard.

25 MR. STUCKARD: We had a little
.

34


1 problem with one of streets up there and

2 Mr. Courtright there I gave him the slip and

3 he said he might get somebody to fix it.

4 Now, they still have the buses in town yet,

5 we know that, but I heard they are going to

6 raise the prices. I don't know when they

7 are going to do it, it's a buck half it's

8 going to be daytime and night. They

9 shouldn't -- they should keep the same price

10 for the buses. And we have cars parked in

11 the same place where the buses are parking

12 and they can't get up on -- people can't get

13 close to the curb on the cars up by

14 Applebee's is parked they can't get up --

15 the people can't get into the bus out of the

16 bus door and get close to the curb by the

17 drugstore and Applebee's.

18 MS. GATELLI: We'll tell Chief

19 Elliott again. I know he had people there

20 at one time making sure so we will contact

21 them again for you, Jim.

22 MR. STUCKARD: What about the

23 benches. I remember last year I brought it

24 up last year about two years ago, two years

25 I brought it up about benches by Applebee's
.

35


1 and the drug store.

2 MS. GATELLI: Yes, they are working

3 on the benches and they will be coming.

4 MR. STUCKARD: What about Parrot

5 Avenue, the holes are still there and I

6 heard they're going to -- I don't know what

7 they are doing, when they are going to do it

8 because those roads are bad up there, Parrot

9 Avenue, somebody is going to bust a tire or

10 a rim.

11 MS. GATELLI: What block of Parrot

12 Avenue is that?

13 MR. STUCKARD: Right by the school

14 there by Judge's Lumber across right up --

15 they do park -- there is a cross street

16 there. There is a bunch of holes on Parrot

17 Avenue way down on the bottom of the hill.

18 MS. GATELLI: We'll report that for

19 you.

20 MR. STUCKARD: I remember last year,

21 so the police are getting pretty good now.

22 We got some new ones I see. I'm glad so --

23 all right.

24 MS. GATELLI: Thanks, Jim. Reverend

25 Simmons.
.

36


1 MS. SIMMONS: Good evening, Council.

2 My name is Reverend Katherine Simmons,

3 Florence Midtown Crime Watch. I came here

4 tonight to talk about one issue, but in

5 sitting here listening I can't help but talk

6 about something else. Our president

7 announced that he is sending more young men

8 and women across the ocean to fight for our

9 freedoms. There are 3,000 and some young

10 men and women who have entered the ground on

11 our behalf these past months. They said it

12 was for a war on our behalf. They fought

13 for our freedom. Our freedoms need to be

14 fought for, but we need to decide what our

15 freedoms are. What exactly are they over

16 there fighting for? We can't even decide in

17 our own city at our own council meeting what

18 we are here for. Are we supposed to be up

19 here for two minutes or should we shut the

20 citizens up when they speak too long and

21 make us feel uncomfortable. Should we fine

22 tavern owners because they have people in

23 there that smoke when we really should be

24 looking at the alcohol that they are

25 serving, that's what's doing harm. Ask me.
.

37


1 I can take you to drug and alcohol clinics

2 and show you the harm that alcohol does.

3 That's what we should be looking at.

4 We need to go back and start all

5 over again. If we are going to ask our

6 children to give their lives maybe we should

7 look again at our freedoms and decide what

8 they should be fighting for. No better a

9 weekend to look than this one because a

10 wonderful and generous and loving man gave

11 his life. The Reverend Dr. King if he was

12 standing here tonight would have said to

13 you, "Seek out your freedom. Hold onto it

14 and then decide where you want to go with

15 it."

16 Good night.

17 MS. GATELLI: Thank you.

18 MS. BECK: Good evening, Council,

19 Kathy Beck, city resident. After watching

20 the council meeting the night the 2007

21 budget was passed I had several questions

22 and observations, some of which have since

23 been addressed to some extent by some other

24 taxpayers. That evening Ms. Evans who has

25 been constantly attacked by the Scranton
.

38


1 Times for opposing the mayor's budget while

2 proposing no alternatives of her own

3 presented probably 30 or more suggestions to

4 increase revenues and to increase expenses,

5 therefore, eliminating any need for a

6 25 percent tax increase. Since I have not

7 researched all of her recommendations, I

8 cannot come into the support you, however, I

9 would like to offer the following comments:

10 Mrs. Fanucci stated that Mrs. Evans

11 proposals appear to be nothing more than a

12 reduction of services. I assumed that that

13 was due to the elimination of a number of

14 office and administrative positions. At the

15 same time, she failed to comment on the

16 reduction in services that would result from

17 the elimination of nine policemen and up to

18 40 firemen which, by the way, will require

19 the closing of at least one firehouse in the

20 city.

21 Mrs. Fanucci also opposed any

22 reduction in the IT Department because of

23 it's importance. I, too, believe this is an

24 important department in order to maintain an

25 efficiently run government, but on October
.

39


1 the 5th and again on October the 12th

2 Mrs. Fanucci introduced a motion to transfer

3 $60,000 from the IT department to the law

4 department professional services to provide

5 funding for more of all things legal fees.

6 To make matters worse, at one time it was

7 required that the SIT clerks be hired to

8 fill out police reports so that the

9 policeman could stay on the streets to

10 protect our neighborhoods. During the

11 police arbitration Mayor Doherty stated that

12 the SIT clerks were no longer necessary

13 because the police cars were equipped with

14 computers that streamlined police reporting

15 allowing them to complete reports from their

16 cars. The truth is, the computers never

17 worked properly and have not been in the

18 cars for quite sometime. I believe

19 Mr. Courtright or one of our police officers

20 can verify this. This elimination of

21 efficiency has also resulted in a reduction

22 of services since the policemen must

23 complete reports themselves. The $60,000 in

24 the IT budget may be able to help remedy

25 this problem.
.

40


1 I, like my husband, always research

2 areas on which I intend to speak. Since the

3 minutes from the last council meeting are

4 not on the website yet I am going to make a

5 statement that I have not been able to

6 research, but believe is quite accurate from

7 my recollection.

8 Mrs. Fanucci state that there was

9 several items proposed by Mrs. Evans that

10 she would be willing to consider. I believe

11 one was the hotel tax and one might have

12 been the entertainment tax. That's

13 commendable. However, all of these

14 possibilities and many more should have been

15 discussed six months ago, not a month or two

16 after the passage of the budget.

17 Lastly, the night the budget was

18 passed Mrs. Fanucci stated, "In my heart I

19 felt Mrs. Evans' budget was not good."

20 That's your heart felt opinion and

21 that is fine. However, in your mind you

22 should have been developing your own

23 proposals to increase revenue, reduce the

24 expenses, and start pulling the city out of

25 it's financial mess. Even if the fireman's
.

41


1 arbitration is resolved and the

2 neighborhoods experience a further reduction

3 in services, through the loss of 40

4 firefighters and some firehouses this city

5 will still be faced with deficits that need

6 to be remedied. I suggest that every

7 council person start immediately to address

8 the objections that needed to be taken and

9 continue to address them until this matter

10 is won. This can only be done through

11 serious and open minded efforts by all and

12 not by blindly accepting what has been

13 merely fed to you. Thank you for this

14 opportunity.

15 MR. BECK: Good evening. Wayne Beck,

16 city resident. I have come here this

17 evening to address counsel what I believe to

18 be an important issue and at the same time

19 offer some constructive criticism to our new

20 council person, Mr. McGoff. I have been

21 making presentations to council off and on

22 for approximately five years now, although,

23 my comments may not always have been

24 appreciated by every council person, I would

25 challenge anyone to question the validity of
.

42


1 anything that I have said since I place a

2 great deal of importance on research and

3 fact finding.

4 This brings me to the real purpose

5 for being here this evening, a motion to

6 consider limiting public comments to two and

7 a half minutes on the agenda items only

8 early in th e meeting, and two and a half

9 minutes later in the meeting for general

10 comments.

11 First, my comment is to Mr. McGoff,

12 and please don't take this negatively, you

13 have stated that you have not watched

14 Channel 61 and, in fact, don't even

15 subscribe to a cable company that provides

16 this service. You also stated that you were

17 not aware that council persons received a

18 salary for serving. There is nothing wrong

19 with this, but it appears that the only

20 knowledge you have received regarding the

21 city government and it's operation has been

22 through the only newspaper in town. There

23 is a great deal of important valuable

24 information and facts and figures that quote

25 from this podium and information that you
.

43


1 may not otherwise be aware of and that is

2 often more accurate than that printed in the

3 newspaper. Here are just a few of many,

4 many examples:

5 First, during the mayoral campaign

6 and contrary to the concerns voiced by

7 citizens from this podium, the newspaper

8 printed numerous articles stating the

9 problem with crime was merely perceived and

10 insisted that there no gangs in the city and

11 downplayed drug concerns. All of a sudden

12 on December 8, 9 and 10th of 2006 the paper

13 prints four articles regarding a focus on

14 gangs, the Bloods were actually mentioned by

15 name, involvement in drug dealing, police

16 expect crime heists, etcetera.

17 Second, during the caucus meeting

18 attended by PEL during I believe November of

19 2006 I heard a PEL representative say that

20 the city's bond rating had slipped. I

21 attended the next council meeting held at

22 West Scranton High School and asked if I had

23 heard correctly, no one knew. We have a

24 council person that has been appointed

25 liaison within PEL and an administrative
.

44


1 that received a $10,000 a year raise to act

2 as coordinator with PEL and yet this

3 information was not made public at a time

4 when the mayor was seeking a $44 million

5 borrowing that the cause of which would

6 actually be affected by the drop in rating

7 the paper and article on this, by the way,

8 13 days after I questioned.

9 Third, Mr. Gervasi is a consistently

10 coming to this podium with facts and figures

11 that contradict those reported in the

12 newspaper. If they prove him wrong I'm

13 certain they would have to tried to crucify

14 him long ago, but Mr. Gervasi also does his

15 homework.

16 The fact that council's agenda is

17 only placed on the website the afternoon of

18 the meeting is a problem. If council does

19 pass a must sign-in to speak policy and

20 limit speakers to two and a half minutes I

21 offer the following to the citizens:

22 First, everyone attending the

23 meeting sign in to speak. When your name is

24 called you can always decline at that time.

25 Secondly, decide what is important to
.

45


1 address, do you your homework, prepare as

2 lengthy of presentation as you run, bring

3 three, four, five or however many family

4 member or friends you need, sign in

5 consecutively, read your comments until your

6 two and a half minutes have expired and keep

7 passing the presentation back to the next

8 person until it is finished. This way you

9 can actually be allotted much more than your

10 normal five minutes you get now. Or if

11 council follows Robert's Rules of Order I

12 believe a speaker is permitted to relinquish

13 his time to another person which means the

14 second, third and fourth speakers, etcetera,

15 could assign their spots to the first and

16 get the information that's so important in

17 this city out there. Of course, this would

18 all be unnecessary if council reconsiders

19 changing of the procedures presently in

20 place.

21 The bottom line is, no one, council

22 person or citizen deserves to be abused,

23 harassed or threatened. The key is to keep

24 control of the meeting to eliminate

25 problems, not to throw out the baby with the
.

46


1 bath water. The only people that would want

2 to determine legitimate, discerning behaved

3 speakers are those who are afraid of the

4 truth.

5 In the time I have remaining I would

6 like to comment on agenda items, at the same

7 time you're considering a separate time for

8 public comment on agenda only, there have

9 been two recent occasions where votes were

10 made on two very important issues that were

11 never placed on the agenda, specifically,

12 the voting on the mayor's budget and

13 Mr. McTeirnan's replacement. Without

14 rehashing the details I would like to say

15 the manner in which these matters were

16 handled creates a suspicion of secrecy,

17 deception and collusion that should be

18 avoided at all costs. These types of

19 actions are what all voters who seek open

20 government should take under consideration

21 when determining the candidate that they are

22 going to support. Thank you for the

23 opportunity and time.

24 MS. GATELLI: Bill Plant.

25 MR. PLANT: Good evening, Council.
.

47


1 Bill Plant, I'm the manager of Greenridge

2 Bowling Lanes. Would you please clarify for

3 me the enforcement of your smoking ban?

4 MR. MINORA: I can.

5 MR. PLANT: Of all the articles in

6 the paper --

7 MR. MINORA: I can help you with

8 that. It's contained in Section 1476 of the

9 ordinance. If you are the owner or the

10 operator of an establishment that's governed

11 by the nonsmoking ordinance you are not

12 liable for a fine or citation if you do the

13 following, and I'm not going to state it

14 verbatim, but I can read it if necessary:

15 You first post a nonsmoking sign and if

16 a patron lights a cigarette up in your

17 establishment you have to take a reasonable

18 effort to prevent that from happening. The

19 law actually defines reasonable as informing

20 that person, number one, that there no

21 smoking and that he is to take the cigarette

22 outside or put it out or cigar. That's the

23 first reasonable thing, and if he does not,

24 and it's -- the word is and not or, and that

25 operator must then if the person refuses to
.

48


1 put out the cigarette call the Department of

2 Public Safety, but that's basically the

3 police department to come in and cite that

4 person.

5 If the owner or the operator fails

6 to do that they have exposed themselves to a

7 citation. I'd be happy to spend more time

8 with you and show you in the act.

9 MR. PLANT: Well, I'd be glad to go

10 over it with you because obviously in a

11 bowling alley there are 150 gentlemen

12 looking at me and last night I had an

13 incident where some gentlemen lit up and I

14 went over and informed them, I have probably

15 25 signs in the establishment, and they told

16 me that every police officer in the City of

17 Scranton smokes and nobody is going to

18 enforce this anyway, so that was part of my

19 answer. And part of the other businesses in

20 town as the paper shows are ignoring this,

21 so Sunday -- Saturday night after we closed

22 I did post everything and try to abide by

23 your ruling.

24 MR. MINORA: I appreciate that.

25 MR. PLANT: And that's why I'm here.
.

49


1 MR. MINORA: Thank you for that.

2 MR. PLANT: So you are saying we

3 should call the police?

4 MR. MINORA: Yes. Those are the two

5 things you have to do, you then have done

6 what you are supposed to do and, obviously,

7 the police prioritize their calls, I hope

8 they will be able to respond to some of

9 these so the people understand it's a

10 legitimate concern and it will, in fact, be

11 enforced. Will it be enforced every single

12 time somebody calls? Obviously, they are

13 going to be on other calls, it happens from

14 time to time, but I think it's their

15 understanding, I think the administration

16 will be behind the idea of enforcing this

17 and just by statistics 75 percent of the

18 people don't smoke and don't want to smoke

19 anybody else's smoke.

20 MR. PLANT: Thank you.

21 MS. FANUCCI: Attorney Minora, there

22 is something, also, if you want me to, I met

23 with Ray Hayes in the past two days, we have

24 been having meetings and what is going to

25 happen in the next few days or probably in
.

50


1 the next week you are going to receive a

2 letter and the proper signage from the city.

3 What it's going to do is actually tell you

4 step by step in which you are responsible as

5 an owner to implement and how, you know, to

6 enforce this law, so you are going to get

7 all of this. Everyone who is with licensing

8 and inspecting will be getting this law and

9 these plaques and these signs, so it will

10 help you know exactly how to follow the law.

11 Until then we have not been enforcing it.

12 Probably these men are right they have not

13 been writing citations or anything at this

14 stage right now, but in the next week as

15 soon as everyone is properly informed it is

16 more important right now at this stage to

17 educate and compliance and then we will

18 worry about going out and enforce, but that

19 probably will be happening as soon as you

20 receive your letter.

21 MR. PLANT: Once the signage is

22 delivered.

23 MR. FANUCCI: Once the signage is

24 done and they will tell you exactly where to

25 post the signage and exactly how to
.

51


1 implement this plan so we will clear all of

2 this up because I know that it's frustrating

3 to you and we have been working hard and

4 making sure that it is easier for you to

5 enforce it.

6 MR. PLANT: May I ask if you are

7 going to introduce the passage tonight about

8 the $1,000 that was in the paper for the

9 owners?

10 MS. GATELLI: Attorney Minora, you

11 maybe could address that, too, about the

12 owner's fine?

13 MR. MINORA: That's what I was

14 explaining before --

15 MS. FANUCCI: As far as myself, not

16 tonight, I am not going to introduce the

17 $1,000 increase. I had sat down with

18 Attorney Minora and a few other people who

19 decided that right now it's a $300. If the

20 owners do not want comply and we want this

21 to fit our city and we want it to fit well.

22 We are not out there to try to, you know, a

23 much as they would like to believe to make

24 money off of this, we want this to be a

25 great asset to our city and something we
.

52


1 could be proud of, so I'm not going to -- we

2 are not going to go out and look to do this

3 right now. When we do have amendments which

4 I'm sure we might have some tweaking to do,

5 we will propose all of those at the same

6 time so that it is not piece by piece.

7 MR. MINORA: Five minutes.

8 MS. FANUCCI: Okay?

9 MR. PLANT: Thank you.

10 MR. MINORA: I'll be happy to talk to

11 you after if you want.

12 MS. GATELLI: Les Spindler.

13 MS. SPINDLER: Good evening, Council.

14 Les Spindler. I, too, want to talk about

15 the smoking ban. Last weekend Mrs. Fanucci

16 comment to all of people defying the smoking

17 ban, she said, "Bring it on, we need the

18 money."

19 Well, last Sunday there was a bar on

20 Franklin Avenue that was packed with

21 smokers, they actually had a smoking party.

22 They brought it on where were you,

23 Mrs. Fanucci? There was a lot of money to

24 be had there.

25 MS. FANUCCI: Les, you didn't call
.

53


1 me. Where were you?

2 MR. SPINDLER: I didn't know about it

3 until the next day, but you said, "Bring it

4 on," you were really cocky about it and they

5 brought it on. You were nowhere to be

6 found. It's in the paper. The Ground Round

7 it's in the paper today they are not

8 throwing anybody out. The law is useless

9 the way it is and I said that last week.

10 And I read the paper today where now you

11 might put the onus on the owner. I think

12 somebody said that last week you should have

13 done that right away. Oh, that was me.

14 Maybe you should ask me --

15 MS. GATELLI: It's already in there.

16 MR. SPINDLER: Maybe you should ask

17 me advice next time you want to make a law.

18 MS. FANUCCI: Run for office,

19 Mr. Spindler.

20 MR. SPINDLER: Next thing about

21 Mr. McGoff's motion last week to split

22 citizen's participation, yet another attempt

23 to stop our freedom of speech. Mr. McGoff

24 just wants people to leave before the

25 meeting is over because he was embarrassed
.

54


1 last week when he couldn't answer a question

2 by Lee Morgan.

3 You people are getting paid to stay

4 here all night, we are not. We have other

5 places to go to. We want to come and talk

6 and leave. We don't have to stay here all

7 night, we are not getting paid to do it.

8 You people were elected to stay there all

9 night, we weren't, so it's a terrible rule

10 and a terrible motion.

11 Next thing, Mayor Barletta said a

12 few weeks ago he is a going to hire ten

13 policemen in Hazelton yet three of you up

14 there voted to let go of six policeman with

15 the mayor's budget.

16 MS. GATELLI: That's not true, Les.

17 That's not true, Les.

18 MR. SPINDLER: He is going to let go

19 six policemen.

20 MS. GATELLI: No, he's not.

21 MR. SPINDLER: It's in the budget.

22 MS. GATELLI: It's not in the budget.

23 MR. SPINDLER: And 38 firemen, so I

24 guess --

25 MS. GATELLI: It's not in the budget
.

55


1 and that's not the truth.

2 MR. SPINDLER: Okay.

3 MS. GATELLI: There is not 40 firemen

4 eliminated in the budget.

5 MR. SPINDLER: Next thing, somebody

6 already spoke about this, but I feel bad you

7 were sick last week, Mrs. Gatelli, if you

8 were so sick that you couldn't stay for

9 citizen participation then you should have

10 gone home, but yet you found -- I guess you

11 got good enough or well enough to come back

12 in and vote to keep --

13 MS. GATELLI: Yes, I stayed so I

14 could vote --

15 MR. SPINDLER: I think they have to

16 keep --

17 MS. GATELLI: -- and to do my

18 responsibilities.

19 MR. SPINDLER: You keep calling it's

20 your responsibility to listen to citizen

21 participation, too. It's amazing how you

22 came back in after all of the speakers were

23 done.

24 MS. GATELLI: I hope you don't get

25 sick, Mr. Spindler.
.

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1 MR. SPINDLER: But if I was sick I

2 would have gone home.

3 MR. GATELLI: Well, I resent your

4 comments.

5 MR. SPINDLER: I wouldn't have stayed

6 and voted for everything that the mayor

7 wanted and I think that you made a

8 comment --

9 MS. GATELLI: I vote for what I think

10 is right, not for what the mayor wants.

11 MR. SPINDLER: You made a comment

12 this year you are not a rubber stamp, well,

13 I think you proved last week you are.

14 MS. GATELLI: That's your opinion.

15 Thank you.

16 MR. SPINDLER: A lot of people's

17 opinion.

18 MS. GATELLI: Chris Sledenzski. Fay

19 Franas.

20 MS. FRANAS: Are you waiting for

21 someone else?

22 MS. GATELLI: No, I told them to get

23 him so he knows he has a turn coming.

24 MS. FRANAS: With all due respect,

25 Mr. Minora, I'm going to use this. I have a
.

57


1 funny feeling you don't know how to keep

2 time here. I'm using my own timer.

3 MR. MINORA: It's starting when you

4 get called.

5 MS. FRANAS: Pardon me?

6 MR. MINORA: It's started when you

7 get called.

8 MS. FRANAS: Hang in there. It's

9 moving.

10 MS. GATELLI: Excuse me.

11 (Ms. Gatelli gavels audience.)

12 MS. FRANAS: Last night when I

13 watched the president speak he mentioned a

14 thing about democracy like Reverend Simmons

15 mentioned and he mentioned that he was

16 sending 22,0000 troops over to Iraq to give

17 them democracy and freedoms. I think they

18 should send the 22,000 soldiers to Scranton

19 to get our rights back, to heck with Iraq.

20 We are losing them every week in this

21 chambers.

22 Mrs. Gatelli, I want to ask you a

23 couple of questions. Who has the authority

24 to bring the policeman in here? Is it you

25 that you request the policeman to be here?
.

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1 MS. GATELLI: Anybody can request the

2 policeman.

3 MS. FRANAS: No, have you -- who has

4 requested them to be here, have you?

5 MS. GATELLI: I have.

6 MS. FRANAS: Then do you have a right

7 to do that?

8 MS. GATELLI: Yes, I do. I think any

9 council has a right to do that.

10 MS. FRANAS: Because you feel

11 threatened?

12 MS. GATELLI: Yes.

13 MS. FRANAS: And you don't feel you

14 have should pay for that out of your own,

15 the taxpayers pay for this policeman to be

16 here.

17 MS. GATELLI: No, there is police at

18 all public meetings.

19 MS. FRANAS: And who assigns this

20 policeman to be here?

21 MS. GATELLI: Officer Elliott, James

22 Elliott.

23 MS. FRANAS: Why do you feel you

24 need two?

25 MS. GATELLI: I'd rather not get into
.

59


1 it because it's being investigated and I am

2 not allowed to --

3 MS. FRANAS: You need to investigate

4 why there's two?

5 MS. GATELLI: It's being investigated

6 and I'm not allowed to discuss it.

7 MS. FRANAS: What's being

8 investigated?

9 MS. GATELLI: Some threats.

10 MS. FRANAS: Okay, you cleared that

11 up. Mrs. Gatelli, would you be interested

12 in revisiting the budget since I believe

13 legally you could revisit this budget and

14 not have it the way it was or is?

15 MS. GATELLI: What do you mean

16 revisit it?

17 MS. FRANAS: Bring it back and take

18 some of the things that you already said

19 should be in it out.

20 MS. GATELLI: I don't know if we can

21 do that.

22 MS. FRANAS: Yes, you can do that.

23 MS. GATELLI: I would be interested

24 to sit down and discuss it, yes, I would.

25 MS. FRANAS: Would you be interested
.

60


1 in giving Mrs. Evans some of her motions for

2 the budget?

3 MS. GATELLI: I was interested in

4 some of her things, yes.

5 MS. FRANAS: But didn't approve any.

6 MS. GATELLI: Well, it was package,

7 it was the whole package, but we are working

8 on the amusement tax.

9 MS. FRANAS: You could have used

10 some, you didn't have to take the whole

11 package. And you were mentioning earlier

12 about Mr. Courtright mentioned earlier about

13 Channel 61, well, Jack Finnerty has to be

14 the most decent guy there is and I don't

15 have a doubt in my mind that he will make it

16 possible for 61 to be live here, and as far

17 as being unsafe in the balcony, let me tell

18 tell you something, Mrs. Fanucci, Mrs.

19 Gatelli and Mr. McGoff, the only unsafe

20 conditions of that balcony are going to be

21 when the people get their taxes and they are

22 come to that balcony and probably commit

23 suicide, that's what they are going to be

24 upset about when they get their tax bills.

25 Now, Mr. McGoff, I'd like to ask you a
.

61


1 question, what did you feel that you have

2 done to help the city, the people in the

3 City of Scranton since you weren't elected

4 by the people, what have you done so far as

5 a council member other than the smoking ban

6 to help the people that we are paying you to

7 do? It's a question.

8 MS. GATELLI: They don't have to

9 respond, Ms. Franas.

10 MR. FRANAS: Mr. McGoff, you don't

11 want to respond?

12 MS. GATELLI: You can respond in

13 motions.

14 MS. FRANAS: No, I'm asking him now.

15 MR. MCGOFF: No, I don't wish to

16 respond. If I did respond what I would say

17 was that it would be lengthy and it would

18 probably waste most of the time that you

19 have at the podium.

20 MS. FRANAS: Is that why you don't

21 want to respond now?

22 MR. MCGOFF: Yes.

23 MS. FRANAS: Well, then respond

24 later. Mrs. Fanucci, you mentioned about

25 the $300 fines, I think you better
.

62


1 concentrate on things that are more

2 important. I'm a nonsmoker but let's get

3 serious here. I have a bill passed by

4 council ten years ago for truck traffic in

5 my neighborhood. Four houses in my block

6 caved in, two of them were torn down and my

7 garage caved in because of the caves,

8 because of the truck traffic that's at a

9 $300 for every truck, not one truck was

10 stopped. Now, maybe I should call a

11 policeman when a truck goes up my street?

12 Would they come? I mean, let's gets

13 serious.

14 MS. FANUCCI: Fay, if you came to me

15 with these issues I'd surely sit down with

16 you.

17 MS. FRANAS: I came to you with

18 these issues at council many times.

19 MS. FANUCCI: I never heard anything

20 about truck traffic.

21 MS. FRANAS: Well, maybe you better

22 check the tapes because I discussed it with

23 council many times.

24 MS. GATELLI: Please. Please.

25 MS. FRANAS: Please what?
.

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1 MS. GATELLI: Let's not get

2 confrontational.

3 MR. MINORA: That's five minutes.

4 MS. FRANAS: Not yet.

5 MR. MINORA: Five minutes.

6 MS. FRANAS: I'll let you know. I

7 have a receipt, $11 is very good for me.

8 I'm not leaving until it's up.

9 MS. GATELLI: Attorney Minora is

10 doing the time.

11 MS. FRANAS: So am I. So am I and

12 when it beeps I shall leave. Mrs. Fanucci,

13 I brought this up many times and I wish you

14 would do something about it.

15 MS. GATELLI: Mary Ann Wardell is

16 next.

17 MS. FRANAS: Thank you.

18 MS. WARDELL: Good evening, Council.

19 Mary Ann Wardell, resident of the city. It

20 gives me no pleasure to say this, but if

21 there were a award to be given out for the

22 most unresponsive, uncooperative and worse

23 council this council at this time would get

24 that award hands down. I have never in all

25 of my years of coming to council have I seen
.

64


1 people that have tried to just take away

2 whatever people try to do here.

3 Mr. McGoff, let me say whether you

4 were elected or appointed you will answer to

5 us for your decisions and your votes. We

6 pay your salary. You work for us. You

7 don't work for the mayor even though he is

8 the one that put you there, you don't work

9 for him, you work for us and you owe us an

10 explanation when you are making votes.

11 Mrs. Fanucci, as far as Carl Greco

12 goes, would you please find out for me what

13 these serial suers are doing and what our

14 law department is doing that we have to pay

15 Mr. Greco all of this money that you voted

16 on last year even though you said if he had

17 donated to your campaign you would not

18 not --

19 MS. FANUCCI: I believe you lost that

20 lawsuit and the ethics violation.

21 MS. WARDELL: I didn't lose a

22 lawsuit.

23 MS. FANUCCI: I think --

24 MS. WARDELL: I filed an ethics

25 complaint and it certainly was unethical and
.

65


1 it had nothing to do with your voting on a

2 contract this year, you voted on another

3 contract for him this year.

4 MS. FANUCCI: Yes, I did.

5 MS. WARDELL: Yes, you did. What do

6 they do in our law department?

7 MS. FANUCCI: You have to be kidding.

8 What do they do in our law department?

9 MS. WARDELL: No, I am not kidding.

10 I am not kidding, not at all and also --

11 MS. FANUCCI: Don't ask me questions

12 if you don't want answers.

13 MS. WARDELL: I didn't ask you any

14 questions.

15 MS. GATELLI: Please. Please, don't

16 be confrontational.

17 MS. WARDELL: Let me say this to you,

18 you brought pictures here of your

19 grandchildren and I have grandchildren here

20 that live in the city and you said you

21 didn't want them to carry our debt and you

22 voted to give this mayor 10 million dollars

23 more to blow on whatever and nobody seems to

24 know what is that money going for? Nobody

25 has accounted for that 10 million dollars.
.

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1 Nobody has said, "What is that money for."

2 I don't understand this, I really

3 don't. And as far as being more efficient

4 and breaking up two and a half minutes and

5 two half minutes, does that seem more

6 efficient to you? That you would be calling

7 people up here twice to come up here and

8 speak rather than let them come up here once

9 and get it over with. I don't think that's

10 efficient. I think that's very rude and